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Re: [] Are there no requirements for Innovation?

I personally much rather see only a few really good implementations which get contributions from downstream than a dozen implementations, each having their own set of bugs and implementation differences. Joining existing JEE implementations into a cohesive application server or a MP framework is no easy task either, there is a lot of important glue and possibilities to innovate and provide extra value-added functionalities on top.

Best regards, cen

On 28. 04. 20 11:48, Mihai A. wrote:
Hi Werner, hi Suren, 

By "Innovation" I mean new implementations of certain specs, not necessarily adding proprietary functionalities.

Take JAX-RS for example. Even if there is an implementation which can be reused in any platform, I would ask the platform implementors to
come up with their own JAX-RS implementation: maybe they'll come up with a better one. One that is faster, with less bugs, better exception messages etc.
Of course, you have to let people reuse especially opensource products if they want, but I think there should be a requirement for a
minimum of new implementations.

Best regards,

On Tue, 28 Apr 2020 at 12:06, Werner Keil <werner.keil@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Not sure, what you mean with "rules" but I assume it's APIs or specs?

CXF implements mainly WS related JSRs like JAX-WS, but so far it doesn't look like it migrated to Jakarta EE yet.
Weblogic on the other side was at least until Java EE 7 compatible with the Full Profile, it has not shown any signs of doing this for Jakarta EE 8, but let's see. Tomcat was the RI for Servlet a long time ago, Jetty hopes to be compatible with the new Jakarta EE Servlet spec and maybe others (I heard from its leadership team) and Helidon again I am not aware, that it passes the Servlet TCKs, but it should pass a few MicroProfile TCKs.

There are other examples for projects that use the Servlet spec, Spring probably the most commonly known.
I'm not entirely sure, what these examples have to do with innovation, but there are some new Jakarta EE specs especially NoSQL that seem pretty innovative and recent, although they could take a bit before they are stable and mature enough for the platform.


On Tue, Apr 28, 2020 at 12:57 AM Suren Konathala <konathalasuren@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

JakartaEE (don’t know much about CXF) is standards/specifications 
To make sure your application works per-JakartaEE standards, it needs to follow/implement (say) A,B,C rules. 

JakartaEE (and most standards) define these A, B, C rules and leave the implementation details to the implementor. 

As an implementor, develop your software to conform to A,B,C to be JakartaEE Complaint + do whatever on top of it (your innovations). Obviously the better your innovations/makes things easy/simple for users the more adaptable your product/service is. 

As an example: All the below are servlet containers + (additional features): Apache Tomcat, Jetty, Weblogic, Helidon  


On Sun, Apr 26, 2020 at 5:53 AM Mihai A. <amihaiemil@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hi All,

I know I may be late to the party with the following question, but it just struck me the other day: are there no innovation requirements for certifying a platform as Jakarta EE compatible?

Looking at what we have now, it seems to me that all I have to do is take Glassfish, rebrand it and bam: I have my own certified Jakarta EE platform.

Or take Apache CXF and other bits and pieces implementing the required specs, put them together under a new brand and again, jackpot!

Shouldn't there be a requirement for a minimum of actual implementation effort?
Or maybe there are such requirements and I'm not aware of them...

Best regards,
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