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Re: [jaxrs-dev] Responding

Markus,

 This is going to be my last response on this thread. These long discussions do not really help the project, so I’ll try to make mine as brief as possible:

 * I did respond to all your private e-mails that made sense to do so. So it is still untrue you didn’t hear from Oracle in weeks.

 * This statement,


 says “Sandbox branches and repositories are defined and setup by a project lead”.

 * The process to elect a lead (even an additional one) is described here:


 and it is completely different from writing this, as you did:

ASAP we should vote for a new project lead, as he is completely unresponsive for weeks, and nobody else has administrative rights on GitHub.

Again, please don't judge this as an act of piracy, but apparently Oracle has not time for this, and I want to get work done since weeks.” 

 Again, I’m moving on from this thread. If you want to become a project lead, you can follow the process outlined above and committers can cast their votes.

— Santiago

On Feb 21, 2018, at 2:21 PM, Markus KARG <markus@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Santiago,
 
It seems lots of mails did not reach you, so I really understand that you are confused and feel passed over. But I actually _did_ follow the process! You might not know some things the PMC told me in private; I thought you had been informed by them, also.
 
But assured, all my actions definitively are in 100% perfect alignment with the EDP, and I did exactly what the PMC, the PMC lead, and the EMO told me. Moreover, all my steps had been announced to / negotiated with them!
 
Unfortunately you have to read the full remainder of this really, really long explanation to understand… If after reading you still feel that I did not follow the EDP, please tell me which chapter of the EDP or which official announcement of the PMC I did not follow, so I will definitively think over my actions! I cannot see that I "clearly" did not follow the process.
 
Let me explain verbosely so you understand what happened _actually_ (from my view angle):
 
* Months ago, when it was totally unclear to the community how the JAX-RS future will look like, I applied for project leadership, in case Oracle will not further want to lead this project. This application was sent to David Delabasse in reaction to his official request of feedback regarding EE4J (IIRC). He forwarded this to Dmitry Kornilov, who later became PMC lead, when the PMC was asked by the EMO who shall be the initial project leads. Dmitry proposed me as a project lead for JAX-RS at the PMC. The PMC decided that _for now_ the existing EG leads shall stay in place _as interim solutions_ until official leadership elections took place. He also told me more in priviate which I cannot tell publicly HERE, so I expected it is ok for you that I do apply. PMC lead Ivar Grimstad told me that for the leadership election I shall start a campaign. While I first responded that I do not see a use in starting a campaign, I later changed my mind and accepted his advice, so I started a campaign in case the leadership elections will happen people will know me and my vision.
 
* The EMO informed me that they had set up a Github Team for JAX-RS leadership and that I had been added to that team (https://github.com/orgs/eclipse-ee4j/teams/eclipse-jaxrs) besides you, Bill Shannon, Dmitry Kornilov and others. A private mailig system was offered to discuss things among those team members. I used that system by full intention as a private channel so we can discuss leadership issues without public interference. It was _there_ where I sent several proposals / requests in a time range of several weeks. While Bill and Dmitry discussed things with me, no reaction at all came from you. In particular, I demanded a schedule so the committers know _for what_ we have to wait and _how long_. As nobody was able or willing to tell this little secret (like "We currently prepare the TCK of the JAX-RS and it will be done in March") I decided to ask the EMO and PMC how to go on.
 
* The EMO informed me that they had set up a mailing list https://accounts.eclipse.org/mailing-list/jaxrs-dev to discuss further JAX-RS development. I did not ask the EMO or PMC to do so, nor did I create that list. I just started the first thread weeks after the list was installed. I even did not notice how few people read that list.
 
* PMC member Kevin Sutter of IBM told me that he is ok with all I wrote on that mailing list as long as I do _not_ ask to _add_ commits to master, which I respected. I only cleaned up some useless commits of yours which does no harm but enforces a single rebase one time as the outcome was identical. I did that to have a clean starting repository and it was announced weeks before (check the above resouces)!
 
* Many people asked me what is status at JAX-RS. They sent me proposals of new features, asked for bug fixes, contributions and so on. So my dilemma was: Neither the PMC nor the project lead, provided the needed answers. The mailing list, the team discussion channel, had been silence for weeks at that point. So it looked like the everybody is ok with my proposals / my actions. Hence I proposed (I did not "decide") separate branches to the other committers to not conflict with master (this is what the EDP wants us to act like), and to separate the work of the already active committers from Oracle's / PMC's work on master (this is what the PMC asked for). One day later, the PMC decided that it is ok if committers to create "sandbox" branches, as long as master is pristine, so I finally created that proposed sandbox branches and asked the committers to put their work there instead of further working against master. IIRC I announced that on the dev mailing list so everybody is informed that it is ok to use these sandbox branches instead of master or instead of creating more branches. At that time, people already created PRs, so I had to act to prevent a mess of conflicts.
 
* Andy McCarthy (not me) asked people on groups.io to come to our dev mailing list, and Christian Kalthepoth (not me) proposed that some other locations should get informed. I said it is not my job, but I can do it. I was asked by him to do that, so I added it on my list of invitations. As the EDP explicitly requests commiters to be communicative on mailing lists, I have such a list and invite people to help us. I do simply not see that this is a project leader's job, but this is everybody's job.
 
* I was asked by people what is "safe" to work on, so I told them to fix bugs and PR against my sandbox branches. This is normal commiter's work according to the EDP.
 
Almost everybody I talked to was ok with my actual actions once they understood that I effectively did not modify master, did not replace you, did not not pass over the PMC, did not pass over the EMO, announced and proposed everything in the official channels, and simply invited people, triaged issues, reviewed PRs, and collected solutions to issues in my sandbox branches. I do not see where I did not follow the EDP by doing that, and I do not see what actually I did that is not a job of a committer according to the EDP but solely a job of a project lead! Just point me to the EDP chapter so I will understand why you feel I do not follow the EDP!
 
And yes, if there is a leader election, I hereby apply. But I do not want to replace you. There can be more than one lead! :-) 
 
Thanks and sorry
-Markus
 
From: jaxrs-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jaxrs-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Santiago Pericas-Geertsen
Sent: Dienstag, 20. Februar 2018 17:09
To: jaxrs-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jaxrs-dev] Responding
 
Markus,
 
 I’m not sure what private e-mails that you sent were not responded. I certainly do not appreciate you creating this mailing list to talk about what Oracle has or has not done yet.
 
 As you noticed, we have been busy moving code and issues. We only asked for more time until some processes were finished. 
 
 I’m very confused as to why you’re acting as a Project Lead (making decisions about branches etc) when you are not. If you want to be a Lead, you need to be voted in [1]. You are clearly not following the process at this time.
 
— Santiago
 
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