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Re: [ee4j-community] Time to play the game?
I think I share parts of the sentiments expressed. Personally I find Java EE a very productive platform.

And thinking about it, I think software development is really being made harder and harder.

And as someone who happens to teach beginners programming, I notice more and more of them coming with the mindset of Google: what is docker? What is kubernetes? How can I scale my hello world app? How can I have a quadrillion instances of docker? Should I write the hello world app as a microservice?


I keep asking them to slow down. What I think needs to be emphasized is that 99.99% of apps out there will run just fine with a good old app server on a VM. 

I'm not against all these modern software development practices, what I'm scared of is lots of people buying the hype and believing they need all these quite complex bits when in actual fact, most will do well with the barest minimum. 

Personally as it stands now, I find Java EE works fine. Some APIs need realignment (EJB-CDI) but by and large, the platform is ok. It just works.

It's in this light that I think projects line MicroProfile should be as they are, testbeds to see what sticks so only non fad technologies get standardized.


My two cents from Accra Ghana!! 



Java EE Instructor http://pedanticacademy.com

Writer
https://pedanticdevs.com

Skype: sinaisix6

Phone: +1-330-5161942

On 3 Nov 2017 11:59, "Mihai A." <amihaiemil@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hello All,

I wanted to ask you how is JavaEE going to fight back to Spring and project Jigsaw?

Let me explain: 

These days, I noticed an increasing trend of developing Java (web)apps with Spring + Spring Boot, and running them with Docker. A lot of people seem to not understand JavaEE, they cannot use it properly so, naturally, they prefer to have a fat deployable and use Docker just as a simple OS wrap.

Then here comes project Jigsaw which, it seems to me, is an effort made in the complete opposite direction of JavaEE. I read this article that kept showing on my Twitter feed: 


Basically, with Jigsaw, we can create standalone Java apps which do not need a preset runtime anymore. It encourages developers to follow the monoliths path, building even fatter apps. Because hey, nobody wants to take care of setting the JRE. But they will still play Docker just to spin the app. Do you see the irony?

I cannot understand why more and more developers build fat applications and use Docker only as an OS bubble. Why don't they use Docker for what it was meant, for setting an environment, a platform (JavaEE) and keeping their applications lightweight?

These days, the developer, instead of focusing on lightweight, efficient projects, is burdened with having to know everything: the app couples together (tightly!) concepts such as Spring Boot, Jigsaw, Docker. Everyone is still happy, they enjoy it, not thinking that we are throwing away many years of progress.

Any thoughts on this topic? It's a rather grim view, I know, but I am really curious of what the experts believe. 

Best regards,
Mihai Andronache

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