While I agree that the ATF project needs to be more open, I
think the suggestion that “rebooting the project” might be
necessary is a little extreme for the situation.
The ATF team has a number of outside adopters who seem to be
happy with the openness of the ATF project. That being said, the team clearly
needs to work on publishing their development work, both on their mailing list
and on the website. Thank you for pointing out this problem.
We on the PMC will make sure that ATF improves in this regard.
Co-lead, WTP Project
[mailto:wtp-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bjorn Freeman-Benson
Sent: Friday, August 03, 2007 9:30 AM
To: atf-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx; wtp-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx; 'Bjorn Freeman-Benson'
Subject: [wtp-pmc] Re: [atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source
ATF Developers, Webtools PMC,
I was disappointed to read this statement (below) in the atf-dev mailing list.
A project is not open and transparent unless it is open and transparent all
the time. My experience is that people (and groups of people; even me)
always revert to base behavior under stress. In other words, if you can't stay
open and transparent during a "heads down" cycle, then you aren't
really committed to being open and transparent.
Related to that, I browsed around your mailing list archives, newsgroup
archives, and project website:
- Your 2.1 downloads do not have the word
"incubation" in them. Your project is no longer
- You are not using the standard Eclipse version
numbering as 0.2.1 is not (in Eclipse naming) a milestone of 0.2. It
should be something more like 0.2.1M4.
- I couldn't find a project plan. I found this roadmap but it's out
of date. Plus it has no dates.
- Are you all doing Eclipse-standard six week
milestones aiming for a 1.0 release? You should be, but I don't see any
documentation of it anywhere.
- I see
that code is being written, but I don't see much/any discussion of design,
architecture, use cases, unit tests, or development in the dev
- I looked at the ATF wiki. All but one of
the pages haven't been touched for more than nine months.
The project is just not being
very open and transparent. The WTP PMC needs to crack down on the ATF project
and either get them to be an open and transparent and Eclipse-like project or
to reboot the project with a different team that will be. This could be a
really cool project for Eclipse and the Eclipse community. But not as a
closed-shop project with an open source repository. It's not good for Eclipse
and it's not good for Webtools and it's not good for the ATF project itself.
On Behalf Of Robert Goodman
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 10:13 PM
To: AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion
Subject: Re: [atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source Code
We do generally
have an open meeting. At this time the team is heads down trying to get
something out the door real soon and before I go on vacation. We are just having
impromptu meetings until we get over the hump. I will send you a note, once we
get the meetings started again. We are obviously interested in people who would
like to contribute to the project.
We are interested in the ATF Project and we would like to know
the the project has Open Mettings. How we can participate from this