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[wtp-pmc] Re: [atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source Code

My 2 cents as an adopter (JBoss Tools and Red Hat Developer Studio) of parts of this project is that yes ATF is pretty quiet but the team is open and responsive when I've approached them here or other ways.

I don't think replacing the team is a usable approach, but I would encourage you guys to be more open about what you are working on and especially in context of what I as an adopter can benefit from it.... who knows we will be able to help you fix bugs we bump into when we adopt it.

..and getting more buzz about ATF would be great ;)


Hey lighten up! A little encouragement will work much better than trying to mix "open source" and "conforming" in the same email.


Bjorn Freeman-Benson wrote:
ATF Developers, Webtools PMC,
I was disappointed to read this statement (below) in the atf-dev mailing list. A project is not open and transparent unless it is open and transparent *all the time*. My experience is that people (and groups of people; even me) always revert to base behavior under stress. In other words, if you can't stay open and transparent during a "heads down" cycle, then you aren't really committed to being open and transparent.

Related to that, I browsed around your mailing list archives, newsgroup archives, and project website:

    * Your 2.1 downloads do not have the word "incubation" in them.
      Your project is no longer "incubation-conforming".
    * You are not using the standard Eclipse version numbering as
      0.2.1 is not (in Eclipse naming) a milestone of 0.2. It should
      be something more like 0.2.1M4.
    * I couldn't find a project plan. I found this roadmap
      <> but it's out of date. Plus
      it has no dates.
    * Are you all doing Eclipse-standard six week milestones aiming
      for a 1.0 release? You should be, but I don't see any
      documentation of it anywhere.
    * I see
      that code is being written, but I don't see much/any discussion
      of design, architecture, use cases, unit tests, or development
      in the dev mailing list
    * I looked at the ATF wiki
      <>. All but one of the
      pages haven't been touched for more than nine months.
    * Etc.

The project is just not being very open and transparent. The WTP PMC needs to crack down on the ATF project and either get them to be an open and transparent and Eclipse-like project or to reboot the project with a different team that will be. This could be a really cool project for Eclipse and the Eclipse community. But not as a closed-shop project with an open source repository. It's not good for Eclipse and it's not good for Webtools and it's not good for the ATF project itself.

*Bjorn Freeman-Benson*
Director, Open Source Process <>
Eclipse Foundation <> 	
voice:  	971-327-7323 (Pacific Time)
email: bjorn.freeman-benson@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:bjorn.freeman-benson@xxxxxxxxxxx>

*From:* atf-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:atf-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx> [mailto:atf-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Robert Goodman
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 25, 2007 10:13 PM
*To:* AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion
*Subject:* Re: [atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source Code


We do generally have an open meeting. At this time the team is heads down trying to get something out the door real soon and before I go on vacation. We are just having impromptu meetings until we get over the hump. I will send you a note, once we get the meetings started again. We are obviously interested in people who would like to contribute to the project.

*Victor Osório <xmv746@xxxxxxxxxxxx> <mailto:xmv746@xxxxxxxxxxxx>*
Sent by: atf-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:atf-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx>

07/25/2007 01:14 PM

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AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion <atf-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx> <mailto:atf-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>




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[atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source Code


   We are interested in the ATF Project and we would like to know if
the the project has Open Mettings. How we can participate from this


atf-dev mailing list

John J. Barton email: johnjbarton<at>


atf-dev mailing list

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