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Re: [tools-pmc] Xtend

Looks great to me +1.


From: tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sven Efftinge
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2011 3:10 PM
To: Tools PMC mailing list
Subject: Re: [tools-pmc] Xtend


If you are ok with the idea and there is no further feedback about the document, 

I'd need your +1 for the next step.





On Dec 16, 2011, at 1:30 PM, Sven Efftinge wrote:

Here's the updated version of the document, it also includes a move plan and other things listed under 








On Dec 15, 2011, at 5:22 PM, Wayne Beaton wrote:

The scope needs to explicitly include the word "Xtend"; I think it's implied by the text, but it really needs to be explicit.

The Community section reads like, "we're going to let the community watch us do cool stuff". At least that's my take away. Put another way, it seems that you're only targeting the user community and are ignoring the adopter and developer communities. I think you've got the "transparent" part going, but you need to include a little more "open". There needs to be more about inviting and accepting participation. How will the new project encourage participation of the three communities?

I don't buy your statement that "I personally don't have any expectations regarding community growth." That statement is at odds with your goal to "make Xtend a language/tool which is helpful and enjoyable to use." ;-)


On 12/15/2011 06:06 AM, Sven Efftinge wrote:

Hi all,
coming back to this, what would be the preferred way to propose Xtend2 as a project under Tools?
Wayne said a simple restructuring would be sufficient, while Doug would like to hear more about our expectations regarding community growth.
Let me write something down here, so you can provide comments.
The general idea is to move the already IP-approved code from Xtext to tools.xtend changing the namespace of the bundles to 'org.eclipse.xtend2'.
The first release under the new project would be 2.3 and should be released as part of the Juno release train in June, 2012.
This would be the list of initial committers :
 - Dennis Huebner, itemis
 - Holger Schill, itemis
 - Jan Koehnlein, itemis
 - Knut Wannheden, paranor
 - Michael Clay, codeworkz
 - Moritz Eysholdt, itemis
 - Sebastian Zarnekow, itemis
 - Sven Efftinge, itemis (proposed project lead)
All of them have contributed and plan to contribute on the code base.
The scope of the language is to offer a modern and concise alternative to Java implementations. The project contains anything from the definition and implementation of the language to all kinds of tools supporting development with the language, including powerful Eclipse-based IDE-support.
The language Xtend has a strong focus on leveraging all the good parts of Java, including seamless integration with the huge amount of Java frameworks and libraries out there. Experienced Java developers can get started with Xtend in almost no time, since everything is so familiar. The editor integrates tightly with Eclipse’s Java tooling to ensure a seamless integration in the IDE as well. Everyone who knows how JDT works, will understand the Xtend IDE right away.
The good parts of Java make for a great basis, but Xtend is all about extending that. For instance, you can now simply discard all that boilerplate you are used to generate using your IDE. Reasonable defaults, type inference, and some other powerful features can make code surprisingly readable. Closures and operator overloading are fun things to have as well. With Xtend you can use such beyond-Java features without learning a whole new language.
Xtend is not meant to be a replacement for Java but serves more as an add-on. When working with Xtend you still write the interfaces, enums, and annotations in Java. There’s currently little value in changing the syntax of these concepts, as they are already very compact, well-known, and tooling-wise nicely supported. However, this might change in the future.
To support the growth of the community we are going to:
 - provide a solid and high-quality technology
 - be supportive in bugzilla
 - be supportive on the mailing list 
 - write blog posts
 - write articles
 - give presentations
I personally don't have any expectations regarding community growth. 
The goal is to make Xtend a language/tool which is helpful and enjoyable to use.
Comments are welcome!
Best Regards,
tools-pmc mailing list


Wayne Beaton
The Eclipse Foundation
Twitter: @waynebeaton

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