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Re: [] Why was there never another Logging JSR?

As mentioned IMO this could at most be something for Jakarta Annotations, maybe similar to the Lombok annotations mentioned here under 7.2 

Other than that Spring Boot also not adding any new "framework" of its own is a good indicator why the MP discussion dried out ;-)


On Tue, Apr 28, 2020 at 6:08 PM John Clingan <jclingan@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
FYI, Alex Lewis started a conversation in the MicroProfile community on this about a year ago and it had a lot of discussion (including similar pushback). While it was a good discussion, the effort has more-or-less stalled. 



On Apr 28, 2020, at 9:00 AM, Kito Mann <kito.mann@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

I agree with Reza on this.... the ship has sailed, most projects just use SLF4J or one of the other logging libraries and move on. But having something better in the JDK would be a great idea, independent of Jakarta EE. One of the best things about Java is that there aren't 100 different ways to do everything; at least with logging there are only a few :-).

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On Mon, Apr 13, 2020 at 4:20 PM Reza Rahman <reza_rahman@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In truth, I think the ship has long sailed in reducing any fragmentation in Java logging. Any credible effort now needs to start with the owners of the various logging APIs coming together, most effectively under the auspices of Java SE. I think for Jakarta EE, this is simply too steep of a hill to climb credibly - certainly at the moment.

That said, I do think encouraging discussion on this is a good idea regardless - wherever it may be. Something end user driven may be what is required to get these logging project owners to finally work to address the problem together. 

Reza Rahman
Jakarta EE Ambassador, Author, Blogger, Speaker

Please note views expressed here are my own as an individual community member and do not reflect the views of my employer.

On 4/13/2020 3:47 PM, Werner Keil wrote:

There was an interesting question on Twitter the other day, why beside configuration there had never been a JSR for logging which is also a fundamental aspect of many enterprise applications.

There was in the very early days of the JCP:, but java.util.logging never was vendor-neutral or extendable and unlike the Collections Framework which has many different implementations also at Eclipse I'm not aware any alternate implementation outside the JDK ever existed.

Markus Eisele thought about this when he worked at Red Hat for the first time, several years ago about a decade or so. 
However, the idea never got beyond initial discussions with involved vendors. And from what I heard back then it was a similar kind of vanity and pride by authors of several frameworks like Log4J, LogBack/SLF4J or Apache Commons Logging and of course the JDK team behind JUL. 
Every committer or team insisted, only their project could be the RI for such JSR, so eventually Markus gave up the idea.
Interestingly the JDK picked up the idea mostly to make itself a little more modular and simplify the dependency graph with Java 9:
I am not sure, what exact TCK support exists for this API, but it aims to be easily adoptable by applications which use external logging framework, such as SLF4J or Log4J, so that'll have to do for now, and it does not seem like a Jakarta standard or MP feature is really worth the effort in this case.


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