[
Date Prev][
Date Next][
Thread Prev][
Thread Next][
Date Index][
Thread Index]
[
List Home]
|
RE: [eclipse.org-planning-council] FW:[ui-best-practices-working-group]RE: Eclipse User Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
|
This sure is an open wound isn't it. Right now, I think it is too easy for the contributors on individual projects to focus only on the needs of those projects. And individually, most of the projects are successful in their own domains. As such, it is very difficult to provide focus on the greater Eclipse good.
I keep coming back to managing the Eclipse packages as we would our own Eclipse based products. This involves investing in the whole development cycle from requirements planning (determining the guidelines) to system testing (ensuring they are followed). Where this investment comes from is a good question, but I think it needs to be co-ordinated at a higher level. We certainly can't rely on a hope and a prayer that the projects will step up to do it. I have a hard enough time getting contributions on stuff like this at the project level.
So I guess to answer Mike's question, we really haven't made a decision on how to proceed with this yet. From what I remember of the discussion we kinda got overwelmed by the weight of the details and it fizzled out.
Doug
-----Original Message-----
From: eclipse.org-planning-council-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:eclipse.org-planning-council-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ed Merks
Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 7:36 AM
To: mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx; eclipse.org-planning-council
Cc: eclipse.org-planning-council-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx; 'eclipse.org-planning-council'
Subject: Re: [eclipse.org-planning-council] FW:[ui-best-practices-working-group]RE: Eclipse User Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
Mike,
With regard to the packaging efforts, we've exchanged quite a few notes about who will be responsible for testing the packages. The best we could come up with, given the volunteer staffing basis for all Eclipse projects, is that package owners themselves are 100% responsible and while they will obviously want to rely on the good will and assistance of others to address problems and to help with testing, the buck still stops with the package owners.
While many of us would clearly like to be able to expect more of others, it's just not all that realistic to make demands of folks whom you don't
reimburse to meet those demands. We can certainly induce folks to do
things because package owners may choose to omit components that don't meet quality standards or for which there isn't sufficient resource to adequately test them, but I can't imagine that coercion will be effective.
That being said, peer pressure and public humiliation, might well prove to be quite effective.
There are often quality issues that are far more basic than the excellent guidelines below so I think we must choose our battles wisely and make
progress where we can to the best of our collective abilities. For
example, function that fails and logs an exception is more important to fix than a toolbar button for which there is no corresponding menu action; development reality being what it is, you might only have sufficient resource to address one of the two.
Reading the guidelines I can already see some improvements I ought to make for EMF so I think the guidelines are both simple and excellent . Folks ought to take them seriously and I expect do use them as part of polishing the modeling package.
Ed Merks/Toronto/IBM@IBMCA
mailto: merks@xxxxxxxxxx
905-413-3265 (t/l 313)
"Mike
Milinkovich"
<mike.milinkovich To
@eclipse.org> "'eclipse.org-planning-council'"
Sent by: <eclipse.org-planning-council@eclip
eclipse.org-plann se.org>
ing-council-bounc cc
es@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject
[eclipse.org-planning-council]
01/24/2008 06:53 FW:
AM [ui-best-practices-working-group]
RE: Eclipse User Interface
Guidelines and UI Checklist
Please respond to
mike.milinkovich@
eclipse.org;
Please respond to
"eclipse.org-plan
ning-council"
<eclipse.org-plan
ning-council@ecli
pse.org>
What was the decision with respect to enforcing these UI guidelines for projects included in Ganymede?
Mike Milinkovich
Office: +1.613.224.9461 x228
Mobile: +1.613.220.3223
mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: Mik Kersten [mailto:beatmik@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 1:30 PM
To: 'User Interface Architecture Working Group'
Cc: mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ui-best-practices-working-group] RE: Eclipse User Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
The UI Checklist is now ready for a final review, after which we can determine how best to let people know about the checklist and guidelines:
http://wiki.eclipse.org/UI_Checklist
205326: Update the checklist for developers
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=205326
Mik
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ui-best-practices-working-group-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ui-
> best-practices-working-group-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
> Kimberley Peter
> Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 5:35 AM
> To: mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx; User Interface Architecture Working
> Group
> Cc: 'UI Best Practices Working Group';
> ui-best-practices-working-group- bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [ui-best-practices-working-group] RE: Eclipse User
> Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
>
> Mike,
>
> Thanks.
>
> I'm sure others have additional thoughts on this.
>
> I can offer that we decided to focus on a "Do Do" this round because:
>
> 1) it gave contributors a short list of "if you do anything do this",
> which we thought was more important than Don't Dos, and
> 2) it was what we could accomplish in that time.
>
>
> Regards,
> Kim
> ...................................................................
> UI Design . Rational Software
> IBM Toronto Media Design Studio
>
>
>
>
>
> From: "Mike Milinkovich" <mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> To: "'UI Best Practices Working Group'" <ui-best-practices-
> working-group@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> Date: 12/03/2007 01:13 AM
>
> Subject: [ui-best-practices-working-group] RE: Eclipse User
> Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bob et al,
>
> Thanks for this. It is a small but positive step.
>
> I am curious if there is an intent to update the "Don't Do" list...I
> thought that looked as helpful as the "Do Do".
>
> Mike Milinkovich
> Office: +1.613.224.9461 x228
> Mobile: +1.613.220.3223
> mike.milinkovich@xxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bob Fraser [mailto:bfraser@xxxxxxx]
> > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 6:48 PM
> > To: Mike Milinkovich; 'Bjorn Freeman-Benson'; UI Best Practices
> > Working Group
> > Subject: Eclipse User Interface Guidelines and UI Checklist
> >
> > Bjorn, Mike and others,
> >
> > The User Interface Best Practices Working Group has added 3.x
> updates
> > to the Eclipse User Interface Guidelines. Additional content as
> > been provided in areas such as, ³UI Graphics², ³Property Views² and
> > ³Context Menus².
> > The
> > latest revision of the document can always be found on the wiki at:
> >
> > http://wiki.eclipse.org/User_Interface_Guidelines
> >
> > With regard to the direction that ³Ganymede projects should follow
> the
> > UI
> > Guidelines²: Of course project members should refer to the entire
> > document and follow it as much as is practical. However, the
> > guidelines are expansive, so the UI Best Practices Working Group,
> > has put together a UI Checklist of a dozen items as a ?short list¹
> > of important items.
> >
> > It is challenging to put together a short list everyone can agree
> > on, but we have endeavored to make these items relevant, actionable,
> > and doable.
> > This
> > list can be found at:
> >
> > http://wiki.eclipse.org/UI_Checklist
> >
> > None of this is a set of tablets from the mount and we welcome
> > dialog on the mailing list,
> > ui-best-practices-working-group@xxxxxxxxxxx, via the guidelines
> > update process,
> > http://wiki.eclipse.org/UI_Best_Practices_Update_Process or, for the
> > checklist, on bugzilla
> > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=205326
> > <file://localhost/bugs/show_bug.cgi>
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Bob Fraser
> >
> >
> >
> > Notice: This email message, together with any attachments, may
> > contain information of BEA Systems, Inc., its subsidiaries and
> > affiliated entities, that may be confidential, proprietary,
> > copyrighted and/or legally privileged, and is intended solely for
> the
> > use of the individual or entity named in this message. If you are
> > not the intended recipient, and have received this message in error,
> > please immediately return this by email and then delete it.
>
> _______________________________________________
> ui-best-practices-working-group mailing list
> ui-best-practices-working- group@xxxxxxxxxxx
> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/ui-best-practices-working-
> group
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ui-best-practices-working-group mailing list
> ui-best-practices-working- group@xxxxxxxxxxx
> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/ui-best-practices-working-
> group
_______________________________________________
eclipse.org-planning-council mailing list eclipse.org-planning-council@xxxxxxxxxxx
https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/eclipse.org-planning-council
_______________________________________________
eclipse.org-planning-council mailing list eclipse.org-planning-council@xxxxxxxxxxx
https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/eclipse.org-planning-council
