RE: [eclipse-dev] Re: [e4-dev] Eclipse Project 4.0 Release

[Markus Keller <markus_keller@xxxxxxxxxx>]

I guess most Eclipse users consider themselves
as "developers", so if it says "Developer" and "Release",
then it must be the released new version for developers like me, right?

"Release" sounds quite finished
and "Developer" doesn't restrict the target audience much. I
think "Beta" or "Preview" should be part of the name,
e.g. "Eclipse SDK 4.0 Preview" or "Eclipse Workbench 4.0
Beta".

Or maybe something more poetic like
"Eclipse 4.0 Early Rays"?

Markus

From:	Mike Wilson <Mike_Wilson@xxxxxxxxxx>
To:	"General development mailing list of the Eclipse project." <eclipse-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:	2010-04-28 19:04
Subject:	RE: [eclipse-dev] Re: [e4-dev] Eclipse Project 4.0 Release

---

I'm starting to warm to "Eclipse 4.0 Developer Release".
It seems to have the right feel to me. The intent is for it to be complete
and robust enough that developers from other projects and product teams
can pick it up and begin working with it.

McQ.

John
Arthorne---2010/04/28 12:03:16 PM---We had a discussion about this in the
Eclipse project PMC call today. We agreed that in light of the community
feedback, some s

From:	John Arthorne/Ottawa/IBM@IBMCA
To:	"General development mailing list of the Eclipse project." <eclipse-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:	2010/04/28 12:03 PM
Subject:	RE: [eclipse-dev] Re: [e4-dev] Eclipse Project 4.0 Release

---

We had a discussion about this in the Eclipse project PMC call today. We
agreed that in light of the community feedback, some sort of qualifier
on the name is needed to help send the right message about the release.
We didn't come up with a good candidate for that name in the call, but
will brainstorm on it. The message we want to send is that is a major new
release of the platform, but this is only a small part of the Eclipse Foundation
technology stack. A release is needed so that we can produce something
sufficiently polished for the release train and wider ecosystem of people
building plugins on top of the platform to pick it up and start adopting
it. We will then be in a position to produce a future simultaneous release
that incorporates a 4.x release of the platform. 

Most of us liked the "Indigo/Isaac Preview" direction but ultimately
it will be up to the Planning Council to make the call on whether a 4.x
release will be the basis for the Indigo release. I also suggested something
like "Eclipse 4.0 Developer Release" sets the right tone. It
also just occurred to me that since only the "Eclipse Classic"
package is part of this release, something like "Eclipse Classic 4.0"
would make sense (although this sounds odd that the "classic"
package is ahead of the rest). In any case, everyone please send along
any concrete naming suggestions, and as Ian mentioned there will also be
a regular "evangelism" call for those interested in participating
in the discussion as well. 

John

Eric Clayberg <clayberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: eclipse-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx

04/28/2010 10:17 AM

Please respond to
"General development mailing list of the Eclipse project." <eclipse-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>

To	"General development mailing list of the Eclipse project." <eclipse-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
cc
Subject	RE: [eclipse-dev] Re: [e4-dev] Eclipse Project 4.0 Release

I agree 100%. We are already seeing our commercial customers starting 
to ask (e.g., demand to know) when we will be supporting Eclipse 4.0 
with all of our products. The perception is definitely out there that 
4.0 is the next great release of Eclipse and that 3.6 is just an 
(minor? maintenance?) update to the "old" 3.x version. Anyone
who 
reads these lists or pays close attention to what is really going on 
in Eclipse-land knows better, but that is a small minority compared 
to the huge mass of Eclipse users out there who will simply assume 
that 4.0 is the latest and greatest and the place they should be as 
soon as it is released. Those folks will likely be very disappointed 
if they try to immediately move to 4.0 and discover that only a 
handful of Eclipse.org projects and 3rd party plugins actually 
support it. Some sort of (strong) qualifier (Preview, Beta, Early 
Availability, Early Adopter, etc. are all good) is definitely needed 
to mitigate the possible damage to the Eclipse brand and ecosystem 
and set the proper expectations in the minds of the early adopters 
(and keep the number of those early adopters to a manageable level).

-Eric

>This is a great example of the problem we're facing, and this is just
an
>early example. People are eagerly awaiting Eclipse 4.0, the next
>generation eclipse. You can message until you are blue in the face,
but
>that isn't going to stop the perception that if you call it 4.0, it's
>that 4.0.
>
>So yes, please call this a Preview release or something along that
line.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: eclipse-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>[mailto:eclipse-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Jeff McAffer
>Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2010 9:36 AM
>To: General development mailing list of the Eclipse project.
>Subject: Re: [eclipse-dev] Re: [e4-dev] Eclipse Project 4.0 Release
>
>There could of course be many nuances missed by Google translate but
the
>article seemed mostly like a distillation of John's recent e4/Eclipse
>4.0 clarification post. I don't think they particularly cast the
>situation differently (at least not by that translation).
>
>The problems with expectation that arise are inherent in the naming
>(Eclipse 4.0). As discussed that naming implicitly leads one to believe
>that this is "the Eclipse 4.0 SDK" and it is the "logical
successor to
>3.6".   If we are not comfortable with everyone downloading
and using
>it, then the naming should reflect that with some sort of qualifier
>(e.g., "Preview", "Beta", "Early Availability",
...).  IMHO this sends a
>clear, representative and appropriate message to the community.
>
>Boris' interview article pointed out that we are targetting the 2011
>release train. This is nice positioning. It may be a little to subtle
>however.  That is, its not clear that people will say "hmm,
its not on
>the simultaneous release so it is not stable/bug-free/..." (frankly,
we
>don;t want to promote that idea either). Perhaps we can combine the
>approaches and talk about the upcoming Eclipse 4.0 SDK as the
>"Indigo/Isaac preview"?
>
>Jeff
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