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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Eclipse Installer makes first hand experience on Linux worse

Comments below.

On 04.07.2016 10:43, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote:
Hi everyone,

Oomph runs with GTK2 by default and when you install and run your ide with it (the very first time) the env variables are inherited thus in the very first run users of Neon will see something broken [1] on recent Linux distro (Fedora 24) and that's pretty bad initial experience.
Yes, we noticed that. Though often it was reported that (on Ubuntu) the launched IDE works only when launched by the installer. So that problem is the opposite one. On the ide-dev mailing list I suggested that perhaps which GTK version could be controlled by the installer:
  It is really disturbing that installer/Oomph overrides defaults and decides that it knows better what is on the user machine better than SWT managed to find on the user machine.
It was not an intended design point, but accidental in how the environment is inherited by the child process. We could certainly look into address that concern.
Upon restart of the IDE (when installer/oomph no longer defines env variables) user will see the proper page [2] but the initial experience would be already ruined and we might have lost the chance this user would ever start it again.
Yes, that seems not ideal.
Not to mention that webkitgtk (gtk2 version) is no longer installed by default on latest Ubuntu/Fedora (AFAIK) unless one explicitly installs it or had installed some other application that explicitly requires it. This essentially breaking the Internal web browser [3], making Help center opening in browser tab instead of its own applications and probably others.
The whole thing appears to be a bit of a disaster area. Always bugs that happen only on Linux, that are different depending on which Linux and which GTK. So this is a systemic problem. We'd be more than happy if SWT just worked well in all cases, but it doesn't.
I understand this is just the first start but this is the most important run if we want to grow the user base. Doing such changes without deeply understanding the possible variations and how/when decisions are taken generates too much bad mouth and ruins so much effort spent that I would describe it as unacceptable.
I noticed that when I posted to ide-dev with suggestions for how we might address this issue, there was no response.
I sincerely ask the Oomph project/installer to reconsider these practices.
It seems to me that the GTK problem isn't so easily solved and while GTK 3 will make some happy, for others it will be broken, and vice versa. So I'm not sure there's a well established best practice. And in the end, there are two problem for us. What should the installer itself use? What should the installation use? In both cases, how do we know either decision is a good one across all Linux variant?

In any case, it would definitely be best if the launched IDE didn't inherit the installer's choice. I'm not sure the current mechanism/issue that makes it inherit the choice.

I'd suggest you open a Bugzilla to track this issue.


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