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Home » Modeling » UML2 » Language Workbench?
Language Workbench? [message #476732] Tue, 11 December 2007 16:30 Go to next message
Stefan Kuhn is currently offline Stefan KuhnFriend
Messages: 355
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
hi everyone,

which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?

-stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #476734 is a reply to message #476732] Tue, 11 December 2007 17:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Stefan Kuhn is currently offline Stefan KuhnFriend
Messages: 355
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
forgot to mention:

I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
correct me.

-stefan

SKuhn wrote:
> hi everyone,
>
> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>
> -stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #476741 is a reply to message #476734] Wed, 12 December 2007 11:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Philipp W. Kutter is currently offline Philipp W. KutterFriend
Messages: 306
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi, Stefan.
The proposed way to define new languages by MDA is MOF, not UML.

UML2 is developed with EMF, and it extends EMF to define a complex
language like UML2. But only this single language, and thus they do
nothing like a language workbench, although some things they do, like
package merge may be useful in a language workbench.

In any case, EMF support only means that you can read the UML2 models
as EMF resource, but it does not mean that it supports all UML
constructs for building languages.

Since EMF only corresponds to EMof, one may argue that one has to use
UML2 and then take the full MOF subset. My experience shows that EMF+OCL
is a great startpoint for language workbench.

I had discussions with the MetaEdit people about integration with EMF.
They should comment on this on their own.

M's SoftwareFactories does for sure not rely on EMF/MOF, since this is
their whole point: have a slightly different Meta Object Facility, and
claim that the OMG stack of standards, respectively Eclipses stack
of implementations of these standards is not useful for defining new
langauges.

Regarding the term "langauge workbench", its promoted by people who
mainly speak about the Software Factories, and the Meta Programming
System, and claim that this is new. Such workbenches existed in dozends
in the research community, starting in the 80s with systems like
Centaur and ASF+SDF. The people around the later are now trying to move
things into Eclipse, and proposed something like the Meta Tooling Env
or similar.

Regards, Philipp

SKuhn wrote:
> forgot to mention:
>
> I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
> a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
> correct me.
>
> -stefan
>
> SKuhn wrote:
>> hi everyone,
>>
>> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
>> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
>> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
>> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>>
>> -stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #476744 is a reply to message #476741] Wed, 12 December 2007 14:12 Go to previous message
Stefan Kuhn is currently offline Stefan KuhnFriend
Messages: 355
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
thanks philipp,

I'm aware that the suggested way to define a new language is mof/ecore.
The reason why I want to add DSL-semantics to uml2 via a profile is to
interop with a uml2 based tool chain. Still a 'DSL'-Editor would ease
modeling for domain-experts (newbies). I thought this might be a
common-problem where a Language Workbench/Meta Tool would be useful. My
question is if something like that exists?

-stefan


Philipp W. Kutter wrote:
> Hi, Stefan.
> The proposed way to define new languages by MDA is MOF, not UML.
>
> UML2 is developed with EMF, and it extends EMF to define a complex
> language like UML2. But only this single language, and thus they do
> nothing like a language workbench, although some things they do, like
> package merge may be useful in a language workbench.
>
> In any case, EMF support only means that you can read the UML2 models
> as EMF resource, but it does not mean that it supports all UML
> constructs for building languages.
>
> Since EMF only corresponds to EMof, one may argue that one has to use
> UML2 and then take the full MOF subset. My experience shows that EMF+OCL
> is a great startpoint for language workbench.
>
> I had discussions with the MetaEdit people about integration with EMF.
> They should comment on this on their own.
>
> M's SoftwareFactories does for sure not rely on EMF/MOF, since this is
> their whole point: have a slightly different Meta Object Facility, and
> claim that the OMG stack of standards, respectively Eclipses stack
> of implementations of these standards is not useful for defining new
> langauges.
>
> Regarding the term "langauge workbench", its promoted by people who
> mainly speak about the Software Factories, and the Meta Programming
> System, and claim that this is new. Such workbenches existed in dozends
> in the research community, starting in the 80s with systems like
> Centaur and ASF+SDF. The people around the later are now trying to move
> things into Eclipse, and proposed something like the Meta Tooling Env
> or similar.
>
> Regards, Philipp
>
> SKuhn wrote:
>> forgot to mention:
>>
>> I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
>> a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
>> correct me.
>>
>> -stefan
>>
>> SKuhn wrote:
>>> hi everyone,
>>>
>>> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
>>> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
>>> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
>>> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>>>
>>> -stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #625707 is a reply to message #476732] Tue, 11 December 2007 17:03 Go to previous message
Stefan Kuhn is currently offline Stefan KuhnFriend
Messages: 355
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
forgot to mention:

I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
correct me.

-stefan

SKuhn wrote:
> hi everyone,
>
> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>
> -stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #625714 is a reply to message #476734] Wed, 12 December 2007 11:04 Go to previous message
Philipp W. Kutter is currently offline Philipp W. KutterFriend
Messages: 306
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi, Stefan.
The proposed way to define new languages by MDA is MOF, not UML.

UML2 is developed with EMF, and it extends EMF to define a complex
language like UML2. But only this single language, and thus they do
nothing like a language workbench, although some things they do, like
package merge may be useful in a language workbench.

In any case, EMF support only means that you can read the UML2 models
as EMF resource, but it does not mean that it supports all UML
constructs for building languages.

Since EMF only corresponds to EMof, one may argue that one has to use
UML2 and then take the full MOF subset. My experience shows that EMF+OCL
is a great startpoint for language workbench.

I had discussions with the MetaEdit people about integration with EMF.
They should comment on this on their own.

M's SoftwareFactories does for sure not rely on EMF/MOF, since this is
their whole point: have a slightly different Meta Object Facility, and
claim that the OMG stack of standards, respectively Eclipses stack
of implementations of these standards is not useful for defining new
langauges.

Regarding the term "langauge workbench", its promoted by people who
mainly speak about the Software Factories, and the Meta Programming
System, and claim that this is new. Such workbenches existed in dozends
in the research community, starting in the 80s with systems like
Centaur and ASF+SDF. The people around the later are now trying to move
things into Eclipse, and proposed something like the Meta Tooling Env
or similar.

Regards, Philipp

SKuhn wrote:
> forgot to mention:
>
> I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
> a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
> correct me.
>
> -stefan
>
> SKuhn wrote:
>> hi everyone,
>>
>> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
>> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
>> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
>> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>>
>> -stefan
Re: Language Workbench? [message #625717 is a reply to message #476741] Wed, 12 December 2007 14:12 Go to previous message
Stefan Kuhn is currently offline Stefan KuhnFriend
Messages: 355
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
thanks philipp,

I'm aware that the suggested way to define a new language is mof/ecore.
The reason why I want to add DSL-semantics to uml2 via a profile is to
interop with a uml2 based tool chain. Still a 'DSL'-Editor would ease
modeling for domain-experts (newbies). I thought this might be a
common-problem where a Language Workbench/Meta Tool would be useful. My
question is if something like that exists?

-stefan


Philipp W. Kutter wrote:
> Hi, Stefan.
> The proposed way to define new languages by MDA is MOF, not UML.
>
> UML2 is developed with EMF, and it extends EMF to define a complex
> language like UML2. But only this single language, and thus they do
> nothing like a language workbench, although some things they do, like
> package merge may be useful in a language workbench.
>
> In any case, EMF support only means that you can read the UML2 models
> as EMF resource, but it does not mean that it supports all UML
> constructs for building languages.
>
> Since EMF only corresponds to EMof, one may argue that one has to use
> UML2 and then take the full MOF subset. My experience shows that EMF+OCL
> is a great startpoint for language workbench.
>
> I had discussions with the MetaEdit people about integration with EMF.
> They should comment on this on their own.
>
> M's SoftwareFactories does for sure not rely on EMF/MOF, since this is
> their whole point: have a slightly different Meta Object Facility, and
> claim that the OMG stack of standards, respectively Eclipses stack
> of implementations of these standards is not useful for defining new
> langauges.
>
> Regarding the term "langauge workbench", its promoted by people who
> mainly speak about the Software Factories, and the Meta Programming
> System, and claim that this is new. Such workbenches existed in dozends
> in the research community, starting in the 80s with systems like
> Centaur and ASF+SDF. The people around the later are now trying to move
> things into Eclipse, and proposed something like the Meta Tooling Env
> or similar.
>
> Regards, Philipp
>
> SKuhn wrote:
>> forgot to mention:
>>
>> I assume there's no other 'free' available implementation of uml2 and if
>> a tool support emf it supports eclipse uml2, too. If I'm wrong, please
>> correct me.
>>
>> -stefan
>>
>> SKuhn wrote:
>>> hi everyone,
>>>
>>> which language workbenches are able to use emf/org.eclipse.uml2?
>>> I know GMF,GEF and I guess GEMS is capable , too. Whats about JHotDraw
>>> or MetaCases MetaEdit? Are there any others (except M$
>>> SoftwareFactories) worth mentioning?
>>>
>>> -stefan
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