Home » Archived » Visual Editor (VE) » [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #60726 is a reply to message #60722] |
Fri, 24 September 2004 11:53   |
Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: myersj.nospam.gmail.com
ilias wrote:
>>> If some people had the time and experience, where would they start?
>>>
>>> Can you please point to some concrete thins, like e.g.:
>>> - code locations / modules in CVS
A good thing to start with would be to see if this SWT snippet example
to run properly with the control off screen on OS X:
http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.swt.sni ppets/src/org/eclipse/swt/snippets/Snippet95.java?rev=HEAD&a mp;content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
If it doesn't we need to come up with a way to get it to work.
>
>
> ??? [special locations & documents, relevant for supporting MAC]
>
>>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
> beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
>
>>> - A Task List / Task Sheet "VE Support for Macintosh"
>
>
> ??? [can you provide such a document, thus interested parties know what
> is needed?]
The biggest hurdle right now is finding a way to screen scrape images of
off screen controls in Carbon. We're using platform specific code to
accomplish this on Windows and GTK, we need to come up with an
equivalent solution for Carbon. We could definitely use help in this
area as none of the VE developers are familiar with Carbon.
I started digging through the Carbon API last night and got some leads.
We may be able to create an offscreen graphics world, then use
DrawControlInCurrentPort on the control we're interested in. However I
didn't find any hints on how we can capture a Window's image.
Any help in this area would be great. The discussion should probably go
on in the ve-dev mailing list rather than the newsgroup.
- Jeff
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #60730 is a reply to message #60726] |
Fri, 24 September 2004 14:18 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: ilias.lazaridis.com
Jeff Myers wrote:
> ilias wrote:
>
>>>> If some people had the time and experience, where would they start?
>>>>
>>>> Can you please point to some concrete thins, like e.g.:
>>>> - code locations / modules in CVS
>
> A good thing to start with would be to see if this SWT snippet example
> to run properly with the control off screen on OS X:
> http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.swt.sni ppets/src/org/eclipse/swt/snippets/Snippet95.java?rev=HEAD&a mp;content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
>
> If it doesn't we need to come up with a way to get it to work.
ok [place this information to a document ("task sheet", i don't know the
terminology you use)]
>> ??? [special locations & documents, relevant for supporting MAC]
>>
>>>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
>>
>> beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
>> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
>
> No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
ok [place this information on the task sheet]
>>>> - A Task List / Task Sheet "VE Support for Macintosh"
>>
>> ??? [can you provide such a document, thus interested parties know
>> what is needed?]
>
> The biggest hurdle right now is finding a way to screen scrape images of
[...]
> Any help in this area would be great.
You should help people to help you.
I suggest to place all this information on a "living document" in the
CVS (e.g. "VE support for MAcintosh").
You can point interested parties to this document, invite core
developers to review etc.
Commiters can modify the document, as things change.
> The discussion should probably go
> on in the ve-dev mailing list rather than the newsgroup.
I have currently limited my eclipse evaluation in a users role.
Thus I limit my contribution to the dedicated medium (newsgroups).
[and btw: I don't like mailinglists]
..
--
eclipse.org.project - Increase transparency of eclipse.org
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=73282
--
http://lazaridis.com
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #61082 is a reply to message #60742] |
Sun, 26 September 2004 10:03 |
| Eclipse User |
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"Jeff Myers" <myersj@nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cj4f6t$uat$1@eclipse.org...
> >
> Yup, just ran into the first problem with VE caused by this problem.
> Luckily this one is easy to work around, but others will probably crop
> up as we continue work on OS X.
Quite likely. You basically need to avoid calling or referencing any
Swing/AWT code from your plugin. It is very easy to trip over this problem
even with very benign code. If you can keep all of the Swing/AWT references
isolated to code running in a different VM, you may be OK.
-Eric
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #598997 is a reply to message #60697] |
Thu, 23 September 2004 06:32 |
| Eclipse User |
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Hi ilias
> What is the main reason for the missing macintosh platform support of VE?
Like Rich said we're not Mac users, but we'd love to have it running
there. Does Eclipse work on the Mac without VE ? If so and you install
VE and try to build a Swing class what happens ? If you want to help us
get a Mac version of the VE that'd be fantastic, and my guess is that
for AWT/Swing there shouldn't be any showstoppers as long as Eclipse
runs there. SWT would be more work but it's something that we should
do, so plesae give us the benefit of whatever Mac expertize you have.
Best regards,
Joe Winchester
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599003 is a reply to message #60708] |
Thu, 23 September 2004 07:09 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: ilias.lazaridis.com
Joe Winchester wrote:
> Hi ilias
>
>> What is the main reason for the missing macintosh platform support of VE?
>
>
> Like Rich said we're not Mac users, but we'd love to have it running
> there. Does Eclipse work on the Mac without VE ? If so and you install
> VE and try to build a Swing class what happens ? If you want to help us
> get a Mac version of the VE that'd be fantastic, and my guess is that
> for AWT/Swing there shouldn't be any showstoppers as long as Eclipse
> runs there. SWT would be more work but it's something that we should
> do, so plesae give us the benefit of whatever Mac expertize you have.
I have no Mac expertize, just reviewing this case abstractly (part of an
personal eclipse evaluation that I make).
I try to understand the status and how one could concretely contribute.
(please see my answer to Rich).
..
--
eclipse.org.project - Increase transparency of eclipse.org
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=73282
--
http://lazaridis.com
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599044 is a reply to message #60709] |
Thu, 23 September 2004 14:37 |
| Eclipse User |
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The bug where you can track the problems and discussions for MAC OS support is
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=47716
Regards...
Peter
ilias wrote:
> Rich Kulp wrote:
>
>>
>> ilias wrote:
>>
>>> What is the main reason for the missing macintosh platform support of
>>> VE?
>>
>>
> > Time and experience.
>
> ok.
>
> If some people had the time and experience, where would they start?
>
> Can you please point to some concrete thins, like e.g.:
> - code locations / modules in CVS
> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
> - A Task List / Task Sheet "VE Support for Macintosh"
>
> .
>
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599137 is a reply to message #60708] |
Fri, 24 September 2004 09:42 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: d.sommer.crosssoft.de
Joe Winchester wrote:
> Hi ilias
> > What is the main reason for the missing macintosh platform support of VE?
> Like Rich said we're not Mac users, but we'd love to have it running
> there. Does Eclipse work on the Mac without VE ? If so and you install
> VE and try to build a Swing class what happens ? If you want to help us
> get a Mac version of the VE that'd be fantastic, and my guess is that
> for AWT/Swing there shouldn't be any showstoppers as long as Eclipse
> runs there. SWT would be more work but it's something that we should
> do, so plesae give us the benefit of whatever Mac expertize you have.
> Best regards,
> Joe Winchester
Use Netbeans and you dont have a problem.
It works very very well. And it works on any plattforms.
And it is fast too.
ds
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599165 is a reply to message #60722] |
Fri, 24 September 2004 11:53 |
| Eclipse User |
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ilias wrote:
>>> If some people had the time and experience, where would they start?
>>>
>>> Can you please point to some concrete thins, like e.g.:
>>> - code locations / modules in CVS
A good thing to start with would be to see if this SWT snippet example
to run properly with the control off screen on OS X:
http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.swt.sni ppets/src/org/eclipse/swt/snippets/Snippet95.java?rev=HEAD&a mp;content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
If it doesn't we need to come up with a way to get it to work.
>
>
> ??? [special locations & documents, relevant for supporting MAC]
>
>>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
> beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
>
>>> - A Task List / Task Sheet "VE Support for Macintosh"
>
>
> ??? [can you provide such a document, thus interested parties know what
> is needed?]
The biggest hurdle right now is finding a way to screen scrape images of
off screen controls in Carbon. We're using platform specific code to
accomplish this on Windows and GTK, we need to come up with an
equivalent solution for Carbon. We could definitely use help in this
area as none of the VE developers are familiar with Carbon.
I started digging through the Carbon API last night and got some leads.
We may be able to create an offscreen graphics world, then use
DrawControlInCurrentPort on the control we're interested in. However I
didn't find any hints on how we can capture a Window's image.
Any help in this area would be great. The discussion should probably go
on in the ve-dev mailing list rather than the newsgroup.
- Jeff
|
|
|
| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599198 is a reply to message #60726] |
Fri, 24 September 2004 14:18 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: ilias.lazaridis.com
Jeff Myers wrote:
> ilias wrote:
>
>>>> If some people had the time and experience, where would they start?
>>>>
>>>> Can you please point to some concrete thins, like e.g.:
>>>> - code locations / modules in CVS
>
> A good thing to start with would be to see if this SWT snippet example
> to run properly with the control off screen on OS X:
> http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.swt.sni ppets/src/org/eclipse/swt/snippets/Snippet95.java?rev=HEAD&a mp;content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
>
> If it doesn't we need to come up with a way to get it to work.
ok [place this information to a document ("task sheet", i don't know the
terminology you use)]
>> ??? [special locations & documents, relevant for supporting MAC]
>>
>>>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
>>
>> beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
>> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
>
> No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
ok [place this information on the task sheet]
>>>> - A Task List / Task Sheet "VE Support for Macintosh"
>>
>> ??? [can you provide such a document, thus interested parties know
>> what is needed?]
>
> The biggest hurdle right now is finding a way to screen scrape images of
[...]
> Any help in this area would be great.
You should help people to help you.
I suggest to place all this information on a "living document" in the
CVS (e.g. "VE support for MAcintosh").
You can point interested parties to this document, invite core
developers to review etc.
Commiters can modify the document, as things change.
> The discussion should probably go
> on in the ve-dev mailing list rather than the newsgroup.
I have currently limited my eclipse evaluation in a users role.
Thus I limit my contribution to the dedicated medium (newsgroups).
[and btw: I don't like mailinglists]
..
--
eclipse.org.project - Increase transparency of eclipse.org
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=73282
--
http://lazaridis.com
|
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599262 is a reply to message #60724] |
Sat, 25 September 2004 06:43 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: d.sommer.crosssoft.de
ilias wrote:
> Dirk Sommer wrote:
> > Joe Winchester wrote:
> >
> >>Hi ilias
> >
> >>>What is the main reason for the missing macintosh platform support of VE?
> >
> >>Like Rich said we're not Mac users, but we'd love to have it running
> [...]
> >
> >
> > Use Netbeans and you dont have a problem.
> > It works very very well. And it works on any plattforms.
> > And it is fast too.
> Is this application written with NetBeans?
> Is it based on NetBeans Platform?
> http://crosssoft.de/images/PCS6.html
> ..
Hello,
yes, this application is written with netbeans + java3d.
It do not base on the Netbeans or Eclipse Platform. But we are working on
it, to use the netbeans
plattform, because with the eclpipse platform it is not possible to use
java3d.
DS
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599279 is a reply to message #60726] |
Sat, 25 September 2004 14:13 |
| Eclipse User |
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"Jeff Myers" <myersj@nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cj1fle$7j2$1@eclipse.org...
>
> >>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
> > beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
> > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
>
> No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
Actually, that bug really has nothing to do with SWT_AWT (the failure of
SWT_AWT is just one manifestation of this bug). In fact, the original title
of the bug did not mention SWT_AWT, and I'm not sure why the title was
changed. The bug concerns a *general* inoperability between Eclipse and
Swing/AWT on the Mac which affects quite a few different plugins. It might
not affect the VE as long as you are running any Swing/AWT code externally
to Eclipse.
-Eric
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599304 is a reply to message #60739] |
Sat, 25 September 2004 15:04 |
| Eclipse User |
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Eric Clayberg wrote:
> "Jeff Myers" <myersj@nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cj1fle$7j2$1@eclipse.org...
>
>>>>> - bug reports & feature requests in Bugzilla
>>>
>>>beneath bug 47716, does this bug block VE support for MAC, too?:
>>>https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=67384
>>
>>No, we don't use SWT_AWT at all in VE.
>
>
> Actually, that bug really has nothing to do with SWT_AWT (the failure of
> SWT_AWT is just one manifestation of this bug). In fact, the original title
> of the bug did not mention SWT_AWT, and I'm not sure why the title was
> changed. The bug concerns a *general* inoperability between Eclipse and
> Swing/AWT on the Mac which affects quite a few different plugins. It might
> not affect the VE as long as you are running any Swing/AWT code externally
> to Eclipse.
>
> -Eric
>
>
Yup, just ran into the first problem with VE caused by this problem.
Luckily this one is easy to work around, but others will probably crop
up as we continue work on OS X.
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=75035
- Jeff
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| Re: [MAC] - Main reason that VE does not support MAC [message #599477 is a reply to message #60742] |
Sun, 26 September 2004 10:03 |
| Eclipse User |
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"Jeff Myers" <myersj@nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cj4f6t$uat$1@eclipse.org...
> >
> Yup, just ran into the first problem with VE caused by this problem.
> Luckily this one is easy to work around, but others will probably crop
> up as we continue work on OS X.
Quite likely. You basically need to avoid calling or referencing any
Swing/AWT code from your plugin. It is very easy to trip over this problem
even with very benign code. If you can keep all of the Swing/AWT references
isolated to code running in a different VM, you may be OK.
-Eric
|
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