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Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229662] Tue, 28 August 2007 21:06 Go to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: rneal.ajconsulting.net

"Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've tried
to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development environment.

Eclipse (including JBuilder 2007) is nothing but an exercise in
frustration. Install the product, then apply updates/patches...pretty
standard, right?

Yup...until the update process blows up with no error except "update
failed" and "no stack trace". Want to try again? Sure, just wait
another 10-15 minutes while it checks to see if anything needs to be
updated. You guys should examine the yum update process found on many
Linux systems and mirror that update approach which does updates
intelligently by caching lists of components.

Why the hell, when I pick "update existing" does it keep prompting me to
pick a mirrors when, under "install new", it lets you check a box to let
Eclipse pick the mirror for you? WTF? Every time the update fails, I
have to go through 10-15 minutes of clicking and waiting just to have it
fail again.

I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee, really?
"See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?

Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse to
load. This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
expect to get what I pay for.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229679 is a reply to message #229662] Tue, 28 August 2007 21:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Remy Suen is currently offline Remy SuenFriend
Messages: 462
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:06:49 +0000, Roger Neal wrote:
> "Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've tried
> to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development environment.

No comment. I have never used JBuilder or NetBeans or IntelliJ or any of
those.

My experience is as follows:
Notepad -> TextPad -> JCreator -> Eclipse

> <...complaints about UM...>

I don't like the Update Manager myself either and generally try to avoid
it. The Equinox team is working on a new update/provisioning story that
should hopefully be an end to your frustrations.

http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/Equinox_Provisioning

> I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
> step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee,
> really? "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?

Assuming you have PDE installed (if you downloaded Eclipse SDK / Eclipse
Classic), the steps are as follows.

Window -> Show View -> Other -> PDE Runtime -> Error Log

There may be other error messages, please look at your other logs.

Where are Eclipse's log files located at?
http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ#Where_are_Eclipse.27s_log_fi les_located_at.3F

> Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse to
> load.

I don't know about "refusing to load", but the classpath gets borked at
times, yes. The steps I generally take are Project - Clean, close/reopen
projects, and then close/reopen workspace. Resetting your target plaform
in the preferences page is also useful for PDE classpath issues.

> This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
> expect to get what I pay for.

I am assuming you are being sarcatsic here as the Eclipse platform, the
SDK, and really all the projects that are from eclipse.org, are free, both
literally and in the open source sense.

Of coures, if you are referring to JBuilder 2007, then well, no comment
there again.

Roger, could you tell us what distro you are using, where you got Eclipse,
and which Java runtime environment you are using for Eclipse?
http://wiki.eclipse.org/Graphical_Eclipse_FAQs#How_do_I_find _out_which_Java_runtime_environment_is_being_used_to_run_my_ Eclipse.3F

If you are not using one of the supported target environments and/or am
using GCJ and/or getting Eclipse from the repositories, I recommend you
bring your frustrations up to your distro's packaging team.
http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/readme_eclipse_3. 3.html#TargetOperatingEnvironments

Thank you for your time. :)

In the event that you do not feel like answering these questions or
responding to any of our replies to your message, we wish you safe
endeavours with other IDEs that you may be using in the future. Good luck.

Regards,
Rem
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229695 is a reply to message #229679] Tue, 28 August 2007 22:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Remy,

There are occasions when it's good to send a "customer" to your
competition. This may be one of them. :-p


Remy Chi Jian Suen wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:06:49 +0000, Roger Neal wrote:
>
>> "Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've tried
>> to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development environment.
>>
>
> No comment. I have never used JBuilder or NetBeans or IntelliJ or any of
> those.
>
> My experience is as follows:
> Notepad -> TextPad -> JCreator -> Eclipse
>
>
>> <...complaints about UM...>
>>
>
> I don't like the Update Manager myself either and generally try to avoid
> it. The Equinox team is working on a new update/provisioning story that
> should hopefully be an end to your frustrations.
>
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/Equinox_Provisioning
>
>
>> I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
>> step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee,
>> really? "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?
>>
>
> Assuming you have PDE installed (if you downloaded Eclipse SDK / Eclipse
> Classic), the steps are as follows.
>
> Window -> Show View -> Other -> PDE Runtime -> Error Log
>
> There may be other error messages, please look at your other logs.
>
> Where are Eclipse's log files located at?
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ#Where_are_Eclipse.27s_log_fi les_located_at.3F
>
>
>> Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse to
>> load.
>>
>
> I don't know about "refusing to load", but the classpath gets borked at
> times, yes. The steps I generally take are Project - Clean, close/reopen
> projects, and then close/reopen workspace. Resetting your target plaform
> in the preferences page is also useful for PDE classpath issues.
>
>
>> This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
>> expect to get what I pay for.
>>
>
> I am assuming you are being sarcatsic here as the Eclipse platform, the
> SDK, and really all the projects that are from eclipse.org, are free, both
> literally and in the open source sense.
>
> Of coures, if you are referring to JBuilder 2007, then well, no comment
> there again.
>
> Roger, could you tell us what distro you are using, where you got Eclipse,
> and which Java runtime environment you are using for Eclipse?
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Graphical_Eclipse_FAQs#How_do_I_find _out_which_Java_runtime_environment_is_being_used_to_run_my_ Eclipse.3F
>
> If you are not using one of the supported target environments and/or am
> using GCJ and/or getting Eclipse from the repositories, I recommend you
> bring your frustrations up to your distro's packaging team.
> http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/readme_eclipse_3. 3.html#TargetOperatingEnvironments
>
> Thank you for your time. :)
>
> In the event that you do not feel like answering these questions or
> responding to any of our replies to your message, we wish you safe
> endeavours with other IDEs that you may be using in the future. Good luck.
>
> Regards,
> Rem
>


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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
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<head>
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Remy,<br>
<br>
There are occasions when it's good to send a "customer" to your
competition.&nbsp;&nbsp; This may be one of them.&nbsp; :-p<br>
<br>
<br>
Remy Chi Jian Suen wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:pan.2007.08.28.21.36.46.367937@gmail.com"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:06:49 +0000, Roger Neal wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">"Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've tried
to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development environment.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
No comment. I have never used JBuilder or NetBeans or IntelliJ or any of
those.

My experience is as follows:
Notepad -&gt; TextPad -&gt; JCreator -&gt; Eclipse

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">&lt;...complaints about UM...&gt;
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
I don't like the Update Manager myself either and generally try to avoid
it. The Equinox team is working on a new update/provisioning story that
should hopefully be an end to your frustrations.

<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/Equinox_Provisioning">http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/Equinox_Provisioning</a>

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee,
really? "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Assuming you have PDE installed (if you downloaded Eclipse SDK / Eclipse
Classic), the steps are as follows.

Window -&gt; Show View -&gt; Other -&gt; PDE Runtime -&gt; Error Log

There may be other error messages, please look at your other logs.

Where are Eclipse's log files located at?
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href=" http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ#Where_are_Eclipse.27s_log_fi les_located_at.3F"> http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ#Where_are_Eclipse.27s_log_fi les_located_at.3F</a>

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse to
load.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
I don't know about "refusing to load", but the classpath gets borked at
times, yes. The steps I generally take are Project - Clean, close/reopen
projects, and then close/reopen workspace. Resetting your target plaform
in the preferences page is also useful for PDE classpath issues.

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
expect to get what I pay for.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
I am assuming you are being sarcatsic here as the Eclipse platform, the
SDK, and really all the projects that are from eclipse.org, are free, both
literally and in the open source sense.

Of coures, if you are referring to JBuilder 2007, then well, no comment
there again.

Roger, could you tell us what distro you are using, where you got Eclipse,
and which Java runtime environment you are using for Eclipse?
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href=" http://wiki.eclipse.org/Graphical_Eclipse_FAQs#How_do_I_find _out_which_Java_runtime_environment_is_being_used_to_run_my_ Eclipse.3F"> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Graphical_Eclipse_FAQs#How_do_I_find _out_which_Java_runtime_environment_is_being_used_to_run_my_ Eclipse.3F</a>

If you are not using one of the supported target environments and/or am
using GCJ and/or getting Eclipse from the repositories, I recommend you
bring your frustrations up to your distro's packaging team.
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href=" http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/readme_eclipse_3. 3.html#TargetOperatingEnvironments"> http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/readme_eclipse_3. 3.html#TargetOperatingEnvironments</a>

Thank you for your time. :)

In the event that you do not feel like answering these questions or
responding to any of our replies to your message, we wish you safe
endeavours with other IDEs that you may be using in the future. Good luck.

Regards,
Rem
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>

--------------050309060908090600080707--
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229704 is a reply to message #229662] Wed, 29 August 2007 01:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jigar Shah is currently offline Jigar ShahFriend
Messages: 37
Registered: July 2009
Member
Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and select
same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its really
frustrating.

Roger Neal wrote:
> "Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've tried
> to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development environment.
>
> Eclipse (including JBuilder 2007) is nothing but an exercise in
> frustration. Install the product, then apply updates/patches...pretty
> standard, right?
>
> Yup...until the update process blows up with no error except "update
> failed" and "no stack trace". Want to try again? Sure, just wait
> another 10-15 minutes while it checks to see if anything needs to be
> updated. You guys should examine the yum update process found on many
> Linux systems and mirror that update approach which does updates
> intelligently by caching lists of components.
>
> Why the hell, when I pick "update existing" does it keep prompting me to
> pick a mirrors when, under "install new", it lets you check a box to let
> Eclipse pick the mirror for you? WTF? Every time the update fails, I
> have to go through 10-15 minutes of clicking and waiting just to have it
> fail again.
>
> I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
> step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee, really?
> "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?
>
> Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse to
> load. This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
> expect to get what I pay for.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229803 is a reply to message #229704] Wed, 29 August 2007 11:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

Jigar,

Yet some of us use Eclipse as an IDE for years and never have such a
problem. If you have a reproducible problem, you should open a bugzilla
with the steps to reproduce it so that the problem will get fixed. That
will accomplish far more than simply whining about it. Did you you know
can export all your preferences and then import them somewhere else?


jigar shah wrote:
> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and
> select same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its
> really frustrating.
>
> Roger Neal wrote:
>> "Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've
>> tried to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development
>> environment.
>>
>> Eclipse (including JBuilder 2007) is nothing but an exercise in
>> frustration. Install the product, then apply
>> updates/patches...pretty standard, right?
>>
>> Yup...until the update process blows up with no error except "update
>> failed" and "no stack trace". Want to try again? Sure, just wait
>> another 10-15 minutes while it checks to see if anything needs to be
>> updated. You guys should examine the yum update process found on
>> many Linux systems and mirror that update approach which does updates
>> intelligently by caching lists of components.
>>
>> Why the hell, when I pick "update existing" does it keep prompting me
>> to pick a mirrors when, under "install new", it lets you check a box
>> to let Eclipse pick the mirror for you? WTF? Every time the update
>> fails, I have to go through 10-15 minutes of clicking and waiting
>> just to have it fail again.
>>
>> I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
>> step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee,
>> really? "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?
>>
>> Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse
>> to load. This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this
>> point, I expect to get what I pay for.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229828 is a reply to message #229704] Wed, 29 August 2007 12:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ns_dkerber.ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com

In article <fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org>, jigar_shah83@hotmail.com
says...
> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and select
> same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its really
> frustrating.

Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP pieces,
but never in the basic java IDE functionality.

.....

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229836 is a reply to message #229828] Wed, 29 August 2007 13:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

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Yes, me neither. That's why it's important for people who do have
problems to report them. Maybe something else they've installed is
causing a problem and they end up blaming all of Eclipse for it when it
might be some minor issue in an add-in plugin that could easily be
addressed if only the developers were aware of it. Even when the
community doesn't directly contribute code, the value provided by high
quality bug reports is great and they are typically much appreciated by
the developers.


ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com wrote:
> In article <fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org>, jigar_shah83@hotmail.com
> says...
>
>> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
>> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
>> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and select
>> same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its really
>> frustrating.
>>
>
> Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
> described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP pieces,
> but never in the basic java IDE functionality.
>
> ....
>
>


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Yes, me neither.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229875 is a reply to message #229803] Wed, 29 August 2007 14:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ns_dkerber.ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com

In article <fb3mrb$h3e$1@build.eclipse.org>, merks@ca.ibm.com says...
> Jigar,
>
> Yet some of us use Eclipse as an IDE for years and never have such a
> problem. If you have a reproducible problem, you should open a bugzilla
> with the steps to reproduce it so that the problem will get fixed. That
> will accomplish far more than simply whining about it. Did you you know
> can export all your preferences and then import them somewhere else?

Unfortunately, the problems I've run into are not reproducible on
demand. After everything being fine for weeks, at some point the issue
will start showing up, will continue to cause hassles for several days,
and then go away again, and I've never been able to figure out how to
get it to start showing, or what causes it to stop showing.

If I could just get somebody from the Eclipse dev team to come visit my
computer and look at it here when the trouble is going on, they could
probably figure it out, but not until then.

.....

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #229959 is a reply to message #229875] Thu, 30 August 2007 00:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------060109010809080606050100
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Jigar,

I have had the occasional case of phantom problems where the classpath
just seems to get screwed up; projects refuse to build because their
base project is refusing to build. I have to refresh projects and
shutdown and restart before things get back on track. I'm not sure the
cause and I can't reproduce it on demand either. That's the most
frustrating thing to have a problem that's not reproducible and hence
not really fixable. :-(


ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com wrote:
> In article <fb3mrb$h3e$1@build.eclipse.org>, merks@ca.ibm.com says...
>
>> Jigar,
>>
>> Yet some of us use Eclipse as an IDE for years and never have such a
>> problem. If you have a reproducible problem, you should open a bugzilla
>> with the steps to reproduce it so that the problem will get fixed. That
>> will accomplish far more than simply whining about it. Did you you know
>> can export all your preferences and then import them somewhere else?
>>
>
> Unfortunately, the problems I've run into are not reproducible on
> demand. After everything being fine for weeks, at some point the issue
> will start showing up, will continue to cause hassles for several days,
> and then go away again, and I've never been able to figure out how to
> get it to start showing, or what causes it to stop showing.
>
> If I could just get somebody from the Eclipse dev team to come visit my
> computer and look at it here when the trouble is going on, they could
> probably figure it out, but not until then.
>
> ....
>
>


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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-15"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Jigar,<br>
<br>
I have had the occasional case of phantom problems where the classpath
just seems to get screwed up; projects refuse to build because their
base project is refusing to build.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230126 is a reply to message #229679] Fri, 31 August 2007 16:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: rneal.ajconsulting.net

Remy Chi Jian Suen <remy.suen@gmail.com> wrote in
news:pan.2007.08.28.21.36.46.367937@gmail.com:

> On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:06:49 +0000, Roger Neal wrote:
>> "Frustration" is the only word to describe the numerous times I've
>> tried to use Eclipse. JBuilder 2006 was a great development
>> environment.
>
> No comment. I have never used JBuilder or NetBeans or IntelliJ or any
> of those.
>
> My experience is as follows:
> Notepad -> TextPad -> JCreator -> Eclipse
>
>> <...complaints about UM...>
>
> I don't like the Update Manager myself either and generally try to
> avoid it. The Equinox team is working on a new update/provisioning
> story that should hopefully be an end to your frustrations.
>
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/Equinox_Provisioning
>
>> I was going through the RCP tutorial and it kept crashing on a build
>> step, claiming some plugin version 0.0.0 couldn't be found...gee,
>> really? "See error log"...what F**KING ERROR LOG?!?
>
> Assuming you have PDE installed (if you downloaded Eclipse SDK /
> Eclipse Classic), the steps are as follows.
>
> Window -> Show View -> Other -> PDE Runtime -> Error Log
>
> There may be other error messages, please look at your other logs.
>
> Where are Eclipse's log files located at?
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ#Where_are_Eclipse.27s_log_fi les_located
> _at.3F
>
>> Every so often, the java perspective will just go haywire and refuse
>> to load.
>
> I don't know about "refusing to load", but the classpath gets borked
> at times, yes. The steps I generally take are Project - Clean,
> close/reopen projects, and then close/reopen workspace. Resetting your
> target plaform in the preferences page is also useful for PDE
> classpath issues.
>
>> This product is a piece of garbage. And, yes, at this point, I
>> expect to get what I pay for.
>
> I am assuming you are being sarcatsic here as the Eclipse platform,
> the SDK, and really all the projects that are from eclipse.org, are
> free, both literally and in the open source sense.
>
> Of coures, if you are referring to JBuilder 2007, then well, no
> comment there again.
>
> Roger, could you tell us what distro you are using, where you got
> Eclipse, and which Java runtime environment you are using for Eclipse?
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Graphical_Eclipse_FAQs#How_do_I_find _out_which_
> Java_runtime_environment_is_being_used_to_run_my_Eclipse.3F
>
> If you are not using one of the supported target environments and/or
> am using GCJ and/or getting Eclipse from the repositories, I recommend
> you bring your frustrations up to your distro's packaging team.
> http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/development/readme_eclipse_3. 3.html#Targ
> etOperatingEnvironments
>

I was using 3.2.2. I downloaded the 3.3 Europa J2EE package the other
day was able to do an 'update existing' on it without any problems.
There are quirks here and there, but my blood pressure is down a couple
hundred points as I was able to complete the RCP tutorial.

I'm experimenting with various things. We currently use Sybase EA Server
J2EE application server (aka "Jaguar"). I'm wondering about the correct
approach in developing for it. I see Eclipse supports JBoss, WebSphere,
etc...would I need to create a J2EE connector for Jaguar to use it with
Eclipse? Can you point me in the right direction to get started on that?

tia, RN
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230142 is a reply to message #229828] Fri, 31 August 2007 16:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: rneal.ajconsulting.net

<ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
news:MPG.213f33311ac76dc49896d2@news.eclipse.org:

> In article <fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org>, jigar_shah83@hotmail.com
> says...
>> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
>> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
>> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and
>> select same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its
>> really frustrating.
>
> Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
> described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP
> pieces, but never in the basic java IDE functionality.
>
> ....
>

Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
I'm currently messing with.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230150 is a reply to message #230142] Fri, 31 August 2007 17:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: wharley.bea.com

"Roger Neal" <rneal@ajconsulting.net> wrote in message
news:Xns999D7FC6B277Ebgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34...
> <ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
>
> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
> you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
> I'm currently messing with.


Out of interest, why are you messing with Eclipse anyway? It doesn't seem
to be making you very happy.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230157 is a reply to message #230142] Fri, 31 August 2007 17:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Roger,

You're biased, unbalanced, ill-considered, silly slander really
accomplishes nothing for your cause, whatever it may be. I have to
wonder why you even bother using a piece of crap. You must be a sucker
for punishment. It would seem better if you just went and used some
other piece of crap and slandered the supplier of that instead. Might
I recommend NetBean for you? Eclipse won the best IDE in JDJ Readers
Poll, and a lot of other Eclipse technology did rather well in the other
categories:

http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm

So let me assure you that more than just a few people use it to write
more than just one class. For EMF we've developed more than 1,000,000
lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting better.


Roger Neal wrote:
> <ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
> news:MPG.213f33311ac76dc49896d2@news.eclipse.org:
>
>
>> In article <fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org>, jigar_shah83@hotmail.com
>> says...
>>
>>> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
>>> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
>>> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and
>>> select same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its
>>> really frustrating.
>>>
>> Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
>> described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP
>> pieces, but never in the basic java IDE functionality.
>>
>> ....
>>
>>
>
> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
> you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
> I'm currently messing with.
>


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</head>
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Roger,<br>
<br>
You're biased, unbalanced, ill-considered, silly slander really
accomplishes nothing for your cause, whatever it may be.&nbsp;&nbsp; I have to
wonder why you even bother using a piece of crap. &nbsp; You must be a
sucker for punishment.&nbsp; It would seem better if you just went and used
some other piece of crap and slandered the supplier of that instead. &nbsp;
Might I recommend NetBean for you? &nbsp; Eclipse won the best IDE in JDJ
Readers Poll, and a lot of other Eclipse technology did rather well in
the other categories:<br>
<blockquote><a href="http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm">http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm</a><br>
</blockquote>
So let me assure you that more than just a few people use it to write
more than just one class.&nbsp;&nbsp; For EMF we've developed more than 1,000,000
lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting better.<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Neal wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:Xns999D7FC6B277Ebgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34"
type="cite">
<pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com">&lt;ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com&gt;</a> wrote in
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="news:MPG.213f33311ac76dc49896d2@news.eclipse.org:">news:MPG.213f33311ac76dc49896d2@news.eclipse.org:</a>

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">In article <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org">&lt;fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org&gt;</a>, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jigar_shah83@hotmail.com">jigar_shah83@hotmail.com</a>
says...
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and
select same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its
really frustrating.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP
pieces, but never in the basic java IDE functionality.

.....

</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
I'm currently messing with.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>

--------------090102060400040102030008--
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230165 is a reply to message #230142] Fri, 31 August 2007 17:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Felix Dorner is currently offline Felix DornerFriend
Messages: 676
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Roger Neal wrote:
> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
> you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
> I'm currently messing with.

I am currently working on three related projects that have about 100 000
LOC (Thanks to EMF ;-)) and about hmm - a lot of classes. At least to me
this is REAL work (maintaining everything alone). Everything works.

Maybe don´t touch it for a day or two (yeah that´s hard...) and then try
with a clear and unoffended mind.


Felix
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230172 is a reply to message #230157] Fri, 31 August 2007 17:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Felix Dorner is currently offline Felix DornerFriend
Messages: 676
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
> For EMF we've developed more than 1,000,000
> lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting better.

Holy Sh...
can I delete my last post?

Felix
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230204 is a reply to message #230150] Fri, 31 August 2007 19:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: rneal.ajconsulting.net

"Walter Harley" <wharley@bea.com> wrote in
news:fb9hk5$luo$1@build.eclipse.org:

> "Roger Neal" <rneal@ajconsulting.net> wrote in message
> news:Xns999D7FC6B277Ebgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34...
>> <ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
>>
>> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work.
>> But, if you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3
>> pans out that I'm currently messing with.
>
>
> Out of interest, why are you messing with Eclipse anyway? It doesn't
> seem to be making you very happy.
>
>
>

Because Borland dropped JBuilder and we're not paying $2000 for Eclipse
from Borland.
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230211 is a reply to message #230157] Fri, 31 August 2007 19:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: rneal.ajconsulting.net

Ed Merks <merks@ca.ibm.com> wrote in
news:fb9i54$n50$1@build.eclipse.org:

> Roger,
>
> You're biased, unbalanced, ill-considered, silly slander really
> accomplishes nothing for your cause, whatever it may be. I have to
> wonder why you even bother using a piece of crap. You must be a
> sucker for punishment. It would seem better if you just went and used
> some other piece of crap and slandered the supplier of that instead.
> Might I recommend NetBean for you? Eclipse won the best IDE in JDJ
> Readers Poll, and a lot of other Eclipse technology did rather well in
> the other categories:
>
> http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm
>
> So let me assure you that more than just a few people use it to write
> more than just one class. For EMF we've developed more than
> 1,000,000 lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting
> better.
>

Now, this is the kind of response I expected to my original post. Silly
slander? No, actual experience. I don't care what awards it was given.
Are you a salesman, per chance?
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230219 is a reply to message #230211] Fri, 31 August 2007 19:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: merks.ca.ibm.com

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Roger,

So you send posts for no other reason than to annoy and offend the hard
working people who provide you free software, free service, and free
support? If you have legitimate problems you ought to open a bugzilla
that describes the steps to reproduce it so that the problems will be
fixed. Surely you recognize that Eclipse is working well for the vast
majority of it users and hence if you are having problems---I don't
doubt that you are---they are likely related to something very specific
to your environment or to your configuration. You would be providing
the community a valuable service to accurately describe your problem in
a way that allows the developers to reproduce it. Instead you have a
tantrum that's beneath the dignity of a mature adult. One tantrum out
of frustration is certainly understandable---I've been known to have
them myself---but your pernicious poisonous attitude is most unbecoming.

Am I a salesman?! I'm not sure if you've noticed, but everything at
Eclipse is free. Maybe if you broadened your narrow focus beyond the
end of your own nose, you might notice that there's a big vibrant
community here rife with selfless people who will help you solve your
problems if you'd just stop being offensive.


Roger Neal wrote:
> Ed Merks <merks@ca.ibm.com> wrote in
> news:fb9i54$n50$1@build.eclipse.org:
>
>
>> Roger,
>>
>> You're biased, unbalanced, ill-considered, silly slander really
>> accomplishes nothing for your cause, whatever it may be. I have to
>> wonder why you even bother using a piece of crap. You must be a
>> sucker for punishment. It would seem better if you just went and used
>> some other piece of crap and slandered the supplier of that instead.
>> Might I recommend NetBean for you? Eclipse won the best IDE in JDJ
>> Readers Poll, and a lot of other Eclipse technology did rather well in
>> the other categories:
>>
>> http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm
>>
>> So let me assure you that more than just a few people use it to write
>> more than just one class. For EMF we've developed more than
>> 1,000,000 lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting
>> better.
>>
>>
>
> Now, this is the kind of response I expected to my original post. Silly
> slander? No, actual experience. I don't care what awards it was given.
> Are you a salesman, per chance?
>


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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
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</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Roger,<br>
<br>
So you send posts for no other reason than to annoy and offend the hard
working people who provide you free software, free service, and free
support?&nbsp; If you have legitimate problems you ought to open a bugzilla
that describes the steps to reproduce it so that the problems will be
fixed.&nbsp; Surely you recognize that Eclipse is working well for the vast
majority of it users and hence if you are having problems---I don't
doubt that you are---they are likely related to something very specific
to your environment or to your configuration.&nbsp; You would be providing
the community a valuable service to accurately describe your problem in
a way that allows the developers to reproduce it.&nbsp; Instead you have a
tantrum that's beneath the dignity of a mature adult.&nbsp; One tantrum out
of frustration is certainly understandable---I've been known to have
them myself---but your pernicious poisonous attitude is most unbecoming.<br>
<br>
Am I a salesman?!&nbsp; I'm not sure if you've noticed, but everything at
Eclipse is free.&nbsp; Maybe if you broadened your narrow focus beyond the
end of your own nose, you might notice that there's a big vibrant
community here rife with selfless people who will help you solve your
problems if you'd just stop being offensive.<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Neal wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:Xns999D9E2239C40bgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Ed Merks <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:merks@ca.ibm.com">&lt;merks@ca.ibm.com&gt;</a> wrote in
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="news:fb9i54$n50$1@build.eclipse.org:">news:fb9i54$n50$1@build.eclipse.org:</a>

</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Roger,

You're biased, unbalanced, ill-considered, silly slander really
accomplishes nothing for your cause, whatever it may be. I have to
wonder why you even bother using a piece of crap. You must be a
sucker for punishment. It would seem better if you just went and used
some other piece of crap and slandered the supplier of that instead.
Might I recommend NetBean for you? Eclipse won the best IDE in JDJ
Readers Poll, and a lot of other Eclipse technology did rather well in
the other categories:

<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm">http://java.sys-con.com/read/417254_2.htm</a>

So let me assure you that more than just a few people use it to write
more than just one class. For EMF we've developed more than
1,000,000 lines of code using Eclipse and Eclipse just keeps getting
better.

</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Now, this is the kind of response I expected to my original post. Silly
slander? No, actual experience. I don't care what awards it was given.
Are you a salesman, per chance?
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>

--------------080505060707060003030305--
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230227 is a reply to message #230204] Fri, 31 August 2007 20:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Steve Blass is currently offline Steve BlassFriend
Messages: 276
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
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Roger Neal wrote:
> "Walter Harley" <wharley@bea.com> wrote in
> news:fb9hk5$luo$1@build.eclipse.org:
>
>> "Roger Neal" <rneal@ajconsulting.net> wrote in message
>> news:Xns999D7FC6B277Ebgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34...
>>> <ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
>>>
>>> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work.
>>> But, if you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3
>>> pans out that I'm currently messing with.
>>
>> Out of interest, why are you messing with Eclipse anyway? It doesn't
>> seem to be making you very happy.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Because Borland dropped JBuilder and we're not paying $2000 for Eclipse
> from Borland.
>

You said it yourself when you opened this thread, "I expect to get what
I pay for". In the Eclipse newsgroups you'll find that you get what
you play for. It may take a while for anyone to clue you in about using
WTP to develop against Sybase EA after ragging on our favorite salesman.





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Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230242 is a reply to message #230126] Fri, 31 August 2007 22:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Remy Suen is currently offline Remy SuenFriend
Messages: 462
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On Fri, 31 Aug 2007 16:29:28 +0000, Roger Neal wrote:
> I'm experimenting with various things. We currently use Sybase EA Server
> J2EE application server (aka "Jaguar"). I'm wondering about the correct
> approach in developing for it. I see Eclipse supports JBoss, WebSphere,
> etc...would I need to create a J2EE connector for Jaguar to use it with
> Eclipse? Can you point me in the right direction to get started on that?

Sorry Roger, but I am just an undergraduate student that contributes to
the Eclipse project in his free time. I only do Eclipse development and do
not do any J2EE work. You should try asking on the web tools platform's
newsgroup, they may know more. There may even be an enhancement request
open in bugzilla.

If not, you can always file one, that's what open source is all about. :)

Regards,
Rem
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #230789 is a reply to message #230142] Tue, 04 September 2007 13:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ns_dkerber.ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com

In article <Xns999D7FC6B277Ebgbgbgbg@206.191.52.34>,
rneal@ajconsulting.net says...
> <ns_dkerber@ns_WarrenRogersAssociates.com> wrote in
> news:MPG.213f33311ac76dc49896d2@news.eclipse.org:
>
> > In article <fb2gib$htn$1@build.eclipse.org>, jigar_shah83@hotmail.com
> > says...
> >> Thts true. I think eclipse is just developing an platform not an IDE.
> >> I face problem of workspace everytime. If in some case where eclipse
> >> goes into loop and i need to force kill it; next time i start and
> >> select same workspace it never loads. All customization is gone. Its
> >> really frustrating.
> >
> > Interesting; I've never run into any of the problems that have been
> > described in this thread. I've run into some issues in the WTP
> > pieces, but never in the basic java IDE functionality.
> >
> > ....
> >
>
> Sure, if you create one class with a main() method, it will work. But, if
> you want to do REAL work, well...we'll have to see how 3.3 pans out that
> I'm currently messing with.

Well, my stuff isn't as big and complex as some out there, but it's not
exactly trivial either: approx 140 classes across 8 different packages,
not including the 3rd party libs, and makes connections to two
completely different database types, as well as using property files and
command-line parameters.

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in the
newsgroups if possible).
Creating a converter for UpdateValueStrategy for JFaceDataBinding [message #234255 is a reply to message #230157] Sun, 23 September 2007 15:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: st_clair.flowja.com

Could any one describe with an example how to create an converter that
converts between a Double and a formatted currency as relevant to
JFaceDataBinding:

I have attempted it but on execution it does not work. Below are the two
classes I used along with the Databinding conde.

package examples.corejava.formatters.converters;

============================================================ ==============
import com.ibm.icu.text.NumberFormat;

import com.ibm.icu.util.Currency;
import com.ibm.icu.util.CurrencyAmount;

import java.util.Locale;

import org.apache.commons.validator.routines.AbstractNumberValidato r;
import org.apache.commons.validator.routines.DoubleValidator;

import org.eclipse.core.databinding.conversion.IConverter;


/**
* The <code>DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter</code> class represents
the presentation|domain|UI model for the {@link} UI.
*
* @author $Author$
* @since $version 1.0$
* @HeadURL $HeadURL$
* @Id $Id$
* @LastChangedBy $LastChangedBy$
* @LastChangedDate $Date$
* @revision $Revision$ $Date$
*/
public class DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter implements IConverter
{
//~ Instance fields
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////

DoubleValidator doubleValidator = new DoubleValidator( true,
AbstractNumberValidator.CURRENCY_FORMAT );
Locale locale = Locale.getDefault();
Number number = null;

NumberFormat currencyFormatter = NumberFormat.getCurrencyInstance();

private Object fromType;
private Object toType;

//~ public
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ///////////////

/**
* Creates a new <code>DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter</code> object.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
public DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter()
{
new DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter( new Double( 0.0 ), new String(
"$0.0" ) );

} // end ctor DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter


/**
* Creates a new <code>DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter</code> object.
*
* @param fromType <code>Object</code> @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
* @param toType <code>Object</code> @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
public DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter( Object fromType, Object toType
)
{
this.fromType = fromType;
this.toType = toType;

} // end ctor DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter

//~ Methods
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////

/**
* The <code>convert()</code> method @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
*
* @param fromObject <code>Object</code> @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
*
* @return <code>Object</code> if the <code>convert()</code> @tag
DOCUMENT_ME!.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object convert( Object fromObject )
{
System.out.println( "fromType [" + fromType.toString() + "]" );

if( fromObject instanceof Double )
{
String currency = currencyFormatter.format( new CurrencyAmount( (
Double ) fromObject, Currency.getInstance( Locale.getDefault() ) ) );

return( currency );

} // end if
else
{
System.err.println( fromObject.toString() + " is not a Double" );

} // end if


return( null );

} // end method convert


/**
* Retrieves the <code>fromType</code> property from this bean.
*
* @return <code>fromType</code> <code>Object</code> if successful.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object getFromType()
{
return( fromType );

} // end method getFromType


/**
* Retrieves the <code>toType</code> property from this bean.
*
* @return <code>toType</code> <code>Object</code> if successful.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object getToType()
{
return( toType );

} // end method getToType

} // end class DoubleToFormattedCurrencyConverter

public class FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter implements IConverter
{
//~ Instance fields
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////

DoubleValidator doubleValidator = new DoubleValidator( true,
AbstractNumberValidator.CURRENCY_FORMAT );
Locale locale = Locale.getDefault();
Number number = null;

private Object fromType;
private Object toType;

//~ public
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ///////////////

/**
* Creates a new <code>FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter</code> object.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
public FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter()
{
new FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter( new String( "$0.0" ), new
Double( 0.0 ) );

} // end ctor FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter


/**
* Creates a new <code>FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter</code> object.
*
* @param fromType <code>Object</code> @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
* @param toType <code>Object</code> @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
public FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter( Object fromType, Object toType
)
{
this.fromType = fromType;
this.toType = toType;

} // end ctor FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter

//~ Methods
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////

/**
* The <code>convert()</code> method @tag DOCUMENT_ME!
*
* @param fromType fromObject <code>Object</code> The object which
must be converted.
*
* @return <code>Object</code> if the <code>convert()</code> is
successful.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object convert( Object fromType )
{
System.out.println( "fromType [" + fromType.toString() + "]" );

if( fromType instanceof String )
{
Double convertedDouble = null;

try
{
convertedDouble = ( Double ) NumberFormat.getCurrencyInstance( locale )
.parse( ( String ) fromType );

}
catch( ParseException e )
{
e.printStackTrace();

} // end try-catch

return( convertedDouble );

} // end if
else
{
System.err.println( fromType.toString() + " is not a String" );

} // end if


return( null );

} // end method convert


/**
* Retrieves the <code>fromType</code> property from this bean.
*
* @return <code>fromType</code> <code>Object</code> if successful.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object getFromType()
{
return( fromType );

} // end method getFromType


/**
* Retrieves the <code>toType</code> property from this bean.
*
* @return <code>toType</code> <code>Object</code> if successful.
*
* @since version 1.0
*/
@Override
public Object getToType()
{
return( toType );

} // end method getToType

} // end class FormattedCurrencyToDoubleConverter

protected DataBindingContext initDataBindings()
{
IObservableValue cashAmountTxtTextObserveWidget =
SWTObservables.observeText( cashAmountTxt, SWT.Modify );
IObservableValue accountCashAmoutObserveValue =
BeansObservables.observeValue( account, "cashAmout" );
IObservableValue accountCashPaymentSummaryAmountObserveValue =
BeansObservables.observeValue( account, "cashPaymentSummaryAmount" );
IObservableValue paymentSummaryTxtTextObserveWidget =
SWTObservables.observeText( paymentSummaryTxt, SWT.Modify );

//
//
DataBindingContext bindingContext = new DataBindingContext();

//
UpdateValueStrategy strategy = new UpdateValueStrategy();
strategy.setConverter( new
examples.corejava.formatters.converters.DoubleToFormattedCur rencyConverter()
);
UpdateValueStrategy strategy_1 = new UpdateValueStrategy();
strategy_1.setConverter( new
examples.corejava.formatters.converters.FormattedCurrencyToD oubleConverter()
);
bindingContext.bindValue( cashAmountTxtTextObserveWidget,
accountCashAmoutObserveValue, strategy, strategy_1 );
UpdateValueStrategy strategy_2 = new UpdateValueStrategy();
strategy_2.setConverter( new
examples.corejava.formatters.converters.DoubleToFormattedCur rencyConverter()
);
UpdateValueStrategy strategy_3 = new UpdateValueStrategy();
strategy_3.setConverter( new
examples.corejava.formatters.converters.FormattedCurrencyToD oubleConverter()
);
bindingContext.bindValue( paymentSummaryTxtTextObserveWidget,
accountCashPaymentSummaryAmountObserveValue, strategy_2, strategy_3 );

//
return( bindingContext );

} // end method initDataBindings
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #1749103 is a reply to message #230219] Thu, 01 December 2016 21:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mark Dear is currently offline Mark DearFriend
Messages: 5
Registered: December 2016
Junior Member
Hello Ed

Nine years later ... I wonder if you still get updates from this post?

I confess that there have been times recently when I have buried my sobbing face in my hands and cried "Eclipse, you piece of ****! Why won't you just ******* work!?"

But that's not who or what I want to be. I want to be someone who says "Great! Here's something not working! Let's have fun trying to figure out why, and fix it!" This is how I imagine Randall Munroe would approach it. Unfortunately, there are problems with this approach - mainly, I'm not good enough, and I don't have the time.

I'll come to my particular issues in a moment, but let me first explain how and why I use Eclipse: simply because, right now, I have to. We are studying domain specific languages with emf, ecore, xtext and xtend. Maybe there's a way to do all that in IntelliJ, but it's not what we're being taught and the course is challenging enough without making additional rods for my own back.

Here are the three issues with which I have had to deal. I'm not posting them here for solutions - there are other places for that - but just to give insight into the frustrations some of us suffer:

1 - Eclipse just closes without warning or reason.
2 - Having been working OK, it hangs on the splash when restarted after a machine restart, logoff, or install.
3 - Pages upon pages of errors appear in the console when launching a new Eclipse application form within Eclipse.

Here's how I dealt / am dealing with them:

1 - After restarting, reinstalling and all the other standard magic buttons I hit the forums, of course. I found the solution on askubuntu.
2 - Workaround seems to be to delete the .metadata folder in the workspace - the whole folder, not just the .lock file it contains.
3 - There is already an eclipse bug report for this here.

And these are my reflections:

1 - How can something like this still apparently be (according to the forum post) a 'famous workaround' at least two years later? If it really is the .ini file that's the problem, why doesn't Eclipse ship with one that doesn't cause this problem?
2 - Having to do this at all is annoying, but more annoying is the lack of information from the splash. The progress bar just stops. If I click on it (or anywhere, for that matter) the splash just disappears. Again this was a forum post solution.
3. I'm still looking at GTK and whatever, but the bug report has been unchanged July and the issue persists. My 'workaround', so to speak, is just not to worry about it any more.

The residual feeling I get from all of this, and other issues which I won't further bloat this post by including, is that I just can't trust Eclipse. It doesn't arrive with the bits it needs to work properly; it won't give me error messages I need; but does give me some I don't. As a student - not yet really even an inexperienced developer - I need a firm place to stand while studying, and Eclipse just doesn't provide that. While issues like this persist, it feels as if Eclipse isn't even taking itself seriously.

I understand that Eclipse is free and that you are indeed not a 'salesman' in the conventional sense - but would it be appropriate to call you instead a 'standard bearer'? For Eclipse to thrive and survive it needs people to be inspired to contribute and enhance. I'd like to be one of those one day, but right now I'm just depressed and miserable.

Cheers MD.

Postscript: I tried to include links to the askubuntu and bug report pages, but I got this message:

"You can only use links to eclipse.org sites while you have fewer than 1 message."

It seems that even using the forums brings arbitrary, annoying and poorly worded error messages. Even more annoying - the message previewed fine, but wouldn't submit. So what was the point of the preview? Sigh.

Post-postscript: having had this message approved, I have now edited again to include the links.

[Updated on: Thu, 01 December 2016 23:40]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #1749122 is a reply to message #1749103] Fri, 02 December 2016 06:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ed Merks is currently offline Ed MerksFriend
Messages: 31539
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Mark Dear wrote on Thu, 01 December 2016 16:15
Hello Ed

Nine years later ... I wonder if you still get updates from this post?

Yes I still look at many forums.

Quote:

I confess that there have been times recently when I have buried my sobbing face in my hands and cried "Eclipse, you piece of ****! Why won't you just ******* work!?"

That sounds like frustration. I spent 1/2 day trying to figure out how to get an embedded SWT browser to work on my Ubuntu virtual box. That was totally frustrating as well, but was mostly an issue of magical things that needed to be installed with cryptic Ubuntu commands. I could have curses Ubuntu at that point...

Quote:

But that's not who or what I want to be. I want to be someone who says "Great! Here's something not working! Let's have fun trying to figure out why, and fix it!" This is how I imagine Randall Munroe would approach it. Unfortunately, there are problems with this approach - mainly, I'm not good enough, and I don't have the time.

Yes, we can't all be Eclipse developers.

Quote:

I'll come to my particular issues in a moment, but let me first explain how and why I use Eclipse: simply because, right now, I have to. We are studying domain specific languages with emf, ecore, xtext and xtend. Maybe there's a way to do all that in IntelliJ, but it's not what we're being taught and the course is challenging enough without making additional rods for my own back.

Yes, Xtext does have IntelliJ support, but I don't know much about that.

Quote:

Here are the three issues with which I have had to deal. I'm not posting them here for solutions - there are other places for that - but just to give insight into the frustrations some of us suffer:

1 - Eclipse just closes without warning or reason.

Sounds like a JVM crash. I mostly develop on Windows where I never see this, but I know on Linux that might be different. In fact, with the native GTK support, some bug in the native integration might cause this.

I know there are often probelms with GTK 3, so perhaps you could try to see if forcing it to GTK 2 helps:

https://www.eclipse.org/forums/index.php?t=msg&th=1071268&goto=1711546&#msg_1711546

Quote:

2 - Having been working OK, it hangs on the splash when restarted after a machine restart, logoff, or install.

I had this happen recently when I installed a version of Mylyn that throws exceptions when opening the task editor. I Googled around to find that I could delete ~/.metadata/.plugins/org.eclipse.e4.workbench/workbench.xmi so that Eclipse would forget about my open editors; because the exceptions thrown reopening them caused the workbench not to come up. That did the trick, but was rather annoying and it did strike me that any casual user would have no idea to do this.

Note that you could have tried to start Eclipse with a different workspace to see if the installation itself is bad or just something wrong in the workspace...

Quote:

3 - Pages upon pages of errors appear in the console when launching a new Eclipse application form within Eclipse.

I can't comment on this. If you don't deploy all the appropriate bundles or have bugs in the application you're writing, all manner of things could be wrong.

Quote:


Here's how I dealt / am dealing with them:

1 - After restarting, reinstalling and all the other standard magic buttons I hit the forums, of course. I found the solution on askubuntu.

So a embedded browser problem was your problem?

Quote:

2 - Workaround seems to be to delete the .metadata folder in the workspace - the whole folder, not just the .lock file it contains.

Perhaps there were buggy views or editors open and the trick I mentioned above would have worked...

Quote:

3 - There is already an eclipse bug report for this here.

Yes, these GTK things are annoying. But if you read the whole history behind all this you realize these are problems with all the various versions and implementations of GTK that are themselves buggy so very hard to fix such that they work on all Linux flavors...

Quote:

And these are my reflections:

1 - How can something like this still apparently be (according to the forum post) a 'famous workaround' at least two years later? If it really is the .ini file that's the problem, why doesn't Eclipse ship with one that doesn't cause this problem?

I believe this is a problem of 2 flavors of GTK, 2 flavors of browser support, and 10 flavors of Linux resulting in no perfect combination that works on all of them.

Quote:

2 - Having to do this at all is annoying, but more annoying is the lack of information from the splash. The progress bar just stops. If I click on it (or anywhere, for that matter) the splash just disappears. Again this was a forum post solution.

Yes, I found that annoying too. I had to manually go find the log file and I wasn't willing to simply delete my workspace. Bad enough I had to reset all my perspectives by deleting the workbench.xmi. If there was a test case to reproduce this, a bug could be filed, but I was focused on my own task...

Quote:

3. I'm still looking at GTK and whatever, but the bug report has been unchanged July and the issue persists. My 'workaround', so to speak, is just not to worry about it any more.

The residual feeling I get from all of this, and other issues which I won't further bloat this post by including, is that I just can't trust Eclipse. It doesn't arrive with the bits it needs to work properly; it won't give me error messages I need; but does give me some I don't. As a student - not yet really even an inexperienced developer - I need a firm place to stand while studying, and Eclipse just doesn't provide that. While issues like this persist, it feels as if Eclipse isn't even taking itself seriously.

I think Linux is the worst version to use because there are too many variation points that can cause problems. And there are way too few people to manage the SWT GTK support. It's not as if anyone makes money from this. To the contrary, it's a money pit...

Quote:


I understand that Eclipse is free and that you are indeed not a 'salesman' in the conventional sense - but would it be appropriate to call you instead a 'standard bearer'? For Eclipse to thrive and survive it needs people to be inspired to contribute and enhance. I'd like to be one of those one day, but right now I'm just depressed and miserable.

I do my best to contribute to Eclipse and often (though not often enough I suppose) try to fix bugs myself or to create quality bug reports.

Quote:

Cheers MD.

Postscript: I tried to include links to the askubuntu and bug report pages, but I got this message:

"You can only use links to eclipse.org sites while you have fewer than 1 message."

It seems that even using the forums brings arbitrary, annoying and poorly worded error messages. Even more annoying - the message previewed fine, but wouldn't submit. So what was the point of the preview? Sigh.

Post-postscript: having had this message approved, I have now edited again to include the links.



Ed Merks
Professional Support: https://www.macromodeling.com/
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #1749331 is a reply to message #1749122] Mon, 05 December 2016 15:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eric Rizzo is currently offline Eric RizzoFriend
Messages: 3071
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
I want to re-iterate 2 points from Ed's excellent response.
1) The crashes you experience are almost certainly related to some combination of the JRE/JDK you're using, the version/package of Eclipse you have, GTK, browser, and some other "black box" Ubuntu components that get involved. As Ed pointed out, Linux is quite honestly a mess when it comes to desktop/UI compatibility and there are simply too many possible combinations for the Eclipse SWT team to cover them all.
2) You would serve yourself well to learn to separate the various things involved (OS, window manager, Java VM, etc.) so as to get adept at narrowing down the scope when you face a mysterious problem like an IDE suddenly crashing. IT's a skill that comes only from experience and probably some amount of natural aptitude for diagnosis, but developing it will serve you quite well as a programmer.

As for helping your specific situation, answer some questions for us:

1) How did you install Eclipse? Was it from Ubuntu's own package manager or downloaded directly from eclipse.org?
2) What version and vendor of Java do you have? Specifically, is it OpenJDK? Have you tried using Oracle's JDK instead?

Hope this helps,
Eric
Re: Why is Eclipse such a piece of crap? [message #1749752 is a reply to message #1749331] Sun, 11 December 2016 02:03 Go to previous message
Mark Dear is currently offline Mark DearFriend
Messages: 5
Registered: December 2016
Junior Member
Thank you for taking the time to respond, Eric. Please accept my apologies for not replying more promptly, we're nearing the Christmas break and I'm in a deadline (and exam) state of mind. It's about 3am where I am right now. To answer your points in the same very clear format you made them:

Ed's responses
1) Maybe. I'm not even sure if you would call these 'crashes' in the strictest sense - eclipse just went away without warning or message (I'll be honest: I haven't looked for a log yet). However, adding the default browser line to the .ini file as per the askubuntu forum thread fixed it. I understand that that doesn't mean it isn't a JDK/JRE issue of some kind, but further investigation will have to wait until the vacation. But it will happen, because ...

2) ... you're right about this, and fortunately, although my knowledge may be limited, my investigative/diagnostic skills are ninja from having been five years 2nd/3rd line application support.

Your questions

1) From the One True Source. Specifically France - CNRS IBCP, as closest to where I am.
2) I did the install/config where you get to choose your JVM. I was very happy to be able to do this, if I could I would utterly purge OpenJDK from my machine and just use the Oracle, but again that's more surgery than I want to do right now. Maybe in the New Year. But, to confirm, I have Oracle 1.8.102 and use it exclusively in Eclipse, IntelliJ and on the command line. I have it set in my path variables in /etc/environment, for all the difference that seems to make.

So, I am, for the moment, stable and able to work. The two outstanding non-critical issues are:

1) Why does that edit to the .ini file work, and
2) All those Glib errors when I launch a second eclipse from inside the first.

But of those can (actually, will have to) wait - but I do want to solve/understand them at some point. I hate not understanding stuff.

Thank you for taking the time to reach out, Eric (and Ed, of course).

Cheers MD.


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