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| hardware for development [message #163909] |
Fri, 11 June 2004 11:22  |
Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: BruceBGordonNoSpam.yahoo.com
I'm going to get a new computer and will primarily use it for java
development under eclipse on Windows. What ram/processor advice do you
have. Will dual processors yield benefits? >1 monitor? Thanks, Bruce
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| Re: hardware for development [message #164083 is a reply to message #164026] |
Fri, 11 June 2004 16:05  |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: BruceBGordonNoSpam.yahoo.com
In article <cad0aa$smu$1@eclipse.org>, eclipse@rizzoweb.com says...
> Bruce Gordon wrote:
>
> > I'm going to get a new computer and will primarily use it for java
> > development under eclipse on Windows. What ram/processor advice do you
> > have. Will dual processors yield benefits? >1 monitor? Thanks, Bruce
>
> As I always recommend for new PC purchases, don't spend your money on
> processor speed. The priorities for Java development aren't a whole lot
Thanks everyone. So how much ram is "really nice". 1GB, 2Gb.I expect to
be working with sizable systems such as JBoss. -Bruce
> different than a general use machine:
> 1) Memory
> 2) Memory
> 3) Memory
> 4) fast disk
> 5) dual-head video card (the second monitor can come later if it's too
> expensive now)
> 6) high-quality mouse and kb (crappy input devices will decrease
> productivity more than most people think)
> 7) Memory
>
> As you can see, RAM is of utmost importance. Any brand-new level
> processor speed is going to be enough, so that is not too important. I
> am skeptical of Windoze's ability to use dual processors very
> efficiently. Perhaps the server versions of the Windoze OSes are better,
> but I've worked on MP windoze boxes before and they never seemed any
> better for day-to-day tasks.
>
> As of Eclipse 3.0x, you can really take advantage of the dual monitors
> by tearing off some views and placing them on the other display. I wish
> they'd had that feature back when I had dual-head on my work computer...
>
> HTH,
> Eric
>
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| Re: hardware for development [message #164218 is a reply to message #163909] |
Sat, 12 June 2004 22:11 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: bytor2001.comcast.net
Bruce Gordon wrote:
> I'm going to get a new computer and will primarily use it for java
> development under eclipse on Windows. What ram/processor advice do you
> have. Will dual processors yield benefits? >1 monitor? Thanks, Bruce
As others have said, the three most important things are Memory, Memory,
and Memory. Here are the things I normally bring up when somebody
asks about configuration of a new box. Much of this is common sense,
but I've to do formal writeups to management for new hardware, so
I always tell them and anybody else more than they need to know.
As usual, though, YMMV.
Memory:
I would recommend 1gig as minimum. Watch your memory usage for a couple
of months. I you need more, buy more.
Processors:
The only software I've seen take good advantage of dual processors under
Windows is Photoshop, so unless you're also doing some PS work, take
the money you'd spend on a second processor and get More Memory...
Monitors:
Dual heads are nice for development. I'll need to get a new graphics
card since 3.x apparently supports this.
Monitors should also be at least 19" and 1280x1024 minimum resolution.
If you can't have both and your eyesight is ok, go with a 17". Right
now I've got an LCD, but that's just because it generates far less heat
and weighs a lot less than a CRT of the same size.
One Eclipse specific note: I always recommend using a light-grey
background instead of white for text. Sitting all day in front of a
screen that is 80% white wears my eyeballs out. A light-grey is not
as harsh and works well the default syntax coloring. Also, make sure
that the shade of grey you select looks ok on printouts. I still like
color printouts, on occasion, for reviewing someone else's code.
Epson, Canon, and HP all make cheap (and expensive) color inkjets
that suit this purpose well.
I have literally tried dozens of mice and keyboards over the years.
I code and game on the same machine, so my demands may be a bit
different than yours.
Mouse:
My Logitech MX-700 wireless mouse rocks. I have two. One is always on
the charger so I never get stalled with the battery getting drained.
Finding this mouse has saved me a ton of mouse-cord related frustration
and write pain.
Keyboard:
I've tried all of Logitech's wireless keyboards, in addition to a couple
of other vendors and gave up. There was always some weird latency
characteristic that I could never get accustomed to when I was gaming.
Logitech, Microsoft, and others make wireless keyboard/mice combos if
you want to completely get rid of the cabling.
BTW, the best thing for avoiding kbd->mouse->kbd movement-related pain
(in your mouse hand) is a keyboard with that IBM trackpoint thing in the
middle of the keyboard that they had/have in ThinkPads. I just can't
find a desktop kbd with one of those things that has a keystroke feel
that I like.
Hard Disk:
How much you need depends on a lot of factors, many not related to
development. The one thing that I do recommend is get 3 disks of
the same size. Go with RAID1 with two of the disks and use the third
for automated backup (incremental, weekly, monthly, whatever). RAID1
protects against a disk crash, the backups help for recovering from
virii and worms. Get a RAID card for this instead of relying on the OS
to do it. Also, make sure it supports your OS before you buy it.
Network/Security:
Three things here:
1) Get a hardware router (e.g. Linksys) and set it up in full firewall
mode. This will protect you from most port-based attacks.
You may also want to get a software firewall product that restricts
internet access from applications on your machine. Spyware and other
kinds of mal-ware are something I'm paranoid about.
2) Do not use any kind of Microsoft product to read your email. Outlook
and Outlook Express are just massive vectors for viruses getting
on to your machine. Just don't do it. Lots of other alternatives
including Mozilla and Yahoo.
3) Reduce your use of Internet Explorer. IE is still an attractive
target for hackers. Don't make yourself a target.
I don't run anti-virus software under XP. Doing the three things I've
listed above (and not running arbitrary exe's from the 'net) removes
virtually all of my exposure to external compromise. If there is some
new kind of vulnerability that hackers discover, I might have to change
things a bit, so I check security advisories occasionally to see what
the bastards are currently up to.
This went on a bit longer than I expected it to, but hopefully some of
it was useful. I could go on about the rest of a developer's environment
(e.g. chair, desk, whiteboard, lighting, sound, distractions,
headphones, music selection :-) but I'm going to try out this thing
called RealLife v1.0: It is Saturday night, after all...
ciao,
-xbytor
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| Re: hardware for development [message #164257 is a reply to message #164218] |
Mon, 14 June 2004 00:46 |
| Eclipse User |
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I pretty much agree with xbytor in almost every aspect. I'll just point out
some things I do if for anything repeat value.
What xbytor does with the two mice thing is kewl. I ahd the wireless
logitech keyboard/mouse and each month they would consume batteries quickly
enough that I found them too expensive. More so, the mouse batteries would
start dying and the darn mouse wouldn't respond as well. They should have
some sort of low battery indicator other than you having to guess that the
battery is dying if the mouse isn't working as well. Same with the keyboard.
Too bad they don't have an induction recharger or something. Having done a
LOT of reading the past two days on batteries, I'd recommend a good
rechargeable battery charger and a few batteries. Make sure you get NiMH,
not NiCad. They offer higher capacity, better recharge, almost no memory
effect, and can be tossed out when they can no longer take a charge. I found
a smart charger that can do 8 or 16 batteries (the 8 version is $84, the 16
version is $124) and it has a "smart" mode that shuts off charging when the
battery tops off, as well as reconditioning capabilities to drain then
recharge if a battery isn't doing so well. It does AA, AAA, C, D and 9V
batteries. The batteries get expensive though. AA are like $13 for 2, and
AAA are about $8 for 2, 9V about $10 each, and so on. The great thing is,
they work better for keyboards/mouse, cameras, walkmens, kids toys than the
expensive alkaline batteries that can not be recharged, and they last 2 to 3
times as long when you get good rechargeables. Ok, so that is slightly
off-topic, but my point in saying all that is so that if you do go with the
wireless, get some rechargeable batteries and get a good set and charger.
Nobody has steered you wrong with memory. I got 768MB on my laptop and with
jboss, jvm, eclipse, mssql all running, it starts getting weighted down. Not
to mention a 4200rpm hd in a laptop just plain sucks! I know they finally
got 7200rpm drives, but they aren't exactly cheap! Having a laptop is nice
though and these days you can get a decent one for $1000, plenty to do
development with, and can take it with you.
For the desktop, definitely get RAID if you can swing it. If you are buying
a ready-made dell (go to www.dellradio.com, you can find a 2.6Ghz, 80GB hd,
CD-RW, 128MB RAM desktop from dell, brand new, for $350 after rebate. Add
some memory and you got a screaming machine for VERY affordable price), you
may have a harder time going RAID unless you add your own RAID card. If you
are lucky enough to build your own, which these days costs more than buying
(but you do get to pick the best of the best parts to go into your machine),
get an ASus or ABit motherboard with nForce2/3 chipset (if you are going
AMD, which I would recommend based on price and performance) that has
firewire, USB2, RAID 0+1, SerailATA + Raid, etc. The benefit is, you can get
yourself two SATA drives, each say 20 or 40GB, and Raid 0 them as your main
drive. This provides a nice boost in HD speed. Then, get a second pair and
like xbytor said, RAID 1 them and use that for projects, data, etc so they
are fail-safe. It may mean 4 or 5 HD's in your desktop, probably more than
most want to deal with, but the benefit is you get speed AND redundancy. If
money is no object and you got a good tower case, this is the route to go.
On the other hand, if you are keeping it slim, stick with RAID 1, or even
two drives. Ideally you want a second drive. With Win2K, at leat, you should
put your page file on the second drive so that the first drive for programs
is not affect by any paging going on if the OS needs to. It speeds up your
system quite a bit by using 2 IDE cables, one for the main drive, one for
the second drive. The downside is, if you dont have another option like
SATA, your will need to run your CD-ROM/RW/DVD-ROM/RW on either a soundcard
IDE cable, or via a USB 2 connector. If you put a HD and a CD/DVD on the
same cable, you'll slow your HD to the speed of the CD/DVD and that is BAD
news. Honestly I forget if you use one IDE cable with two HDs on it if it
will be able to take advantage of the second channel and paging, hence this
nice speedup, or if you have to put the 2nd drive on the other cable
completely! The point is, your main/primary drive should NOT have the page
file on it, which is the default for Windows.
Dual video would be sweet! I would try to use two 19" LCD panels. These days
they can be had for $500 or so for decent ones. Besides the gray background
tip, LCDs let off no radiation that affects eyes, reducing strain to almost
nil. Again, if money is no object, I'd go this route!
The rest sounds good. I just wanted to add my two cents.
"xbytor" <bytor2001@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cagclk$kc7$1@eclipse.org...
> Bruce Gordon wrote:
>
> > I'm going to get a new computer and will primarily use it for java
> > development under eclipse on Windows. What ram/processor advice do you
> > have. Will dual processors yield benefits? >1 monitor? Thanks, Bruce
>
> As others have said, the three most important things are Memory, Memory,
> and Memory. Here are the things I normally bring up when somebody
> asks about configuration of a new box. Much of this is common sense,
> but I've to do formal writeups to management for new hardware, so
> I always tell them and anybody else more than they need to know.
> As usual, though, YMMV.
>
> Memory:
> I would recommend 1gig as minimum. Watch your memory usage for a couple
> of months. I you need more, buy more.
>
> Processors:
> The only software I've seen take good advantage of dual processors under
> Windows is Photoshop, so unless you're also doing some PS work, take
> the money you'd spend on a second processor and get More Memory...
>
> Monitors:
> Dual heads are nice for development. I'll need to get a new graphics
> card since 3.x apparently supports this.
>
> Monitors should also be at least 19" and 1280x1024 minimum resolution.
> If you can't have both and your eyesight is ok, go with a 17". Right
> now I've got an LCD, but that's just because it generates far less heat
> and weighs a lot less than a CRT of the same size.
>
> One Eclipse specific note: I always recommend using a light-grey
> background instead of white for text. Sitting all day in front of a
> screen that is 80% white wears my eyeballs out. A light-grey is not
> as harsh and works well the default syntax coloring. Also, make sure
> that the shade of grey you select looks ok on printouts. I still like
> color printouts, on occasion, for reviewing someone else's code.
> Epson, Canon, and HP all make cheap (and expensive) color inkjets
> that suit this purpose well.
>
>
> I have literally tried dozens of mice and keyboards over the years.
> I code and game on the same machine, so my demands may be a bit
> different than yours.
>
> Mouse:
> My Logitech MX-700 wireless mouse rocks. I have two. One is always on
> the charger so I never get stalled with the battery getting drained.
> Finding this mouse has saved me a ton of mouse-cord related frustration
> and write pain.
>
> Keyboard:
> I've tried all of Logitech's wireless keyboards, in addition to a couple
> of other vendors and gave up. There was always some weird latency
> characteristic that I could never get accustomed to when I was gaming.
>
> Logitech, Microsoft, and others make wireless keyboard/mice combos if
> you want to completely get rid of the cabling.
>
> BTW, the best thing for avoiding kbd->mouse->kbd movement-related pain
> (in your mouse hand) is a keyboard with that IBM trackpoint thing in the
> middle of the keyboard that they had/have in ThinkPads. I just can't
> find a desktop kbd with one of those things that has a keystroke feel
> that I like.
>
> Hard Disk:
> How much you need depends on a lot of factors, many not related to
> development. The one thing that I do recommend is get 3 disks of
> the same size. Go with RAID1 with two of the disks and use the third
> for automated backup (incremental, weekly, monthly, whatever). RAID1
> protects against a disk crash, the backups help for recovering from
> virii and worms. Get a RAID card for this instead of relying on the OS
> to do it. Also, make sure it supports your OS before you buy it.
>
> Network/Security:
> Three things here:
> 1) Get a hardware router (e.g. Linksys) and set it up in full firewall
> mode. This will protect you from most port-based attacks.
> You may also want to get a software firewall product that restricts
> internet access from applications on your machine. Spyware and other
> kinds of mal-ware are something I'm paranoid about.
> 2) Do not use any kind of Microsoft product to read your email. Outlook
> and Outlook Express are just massive vectors for viruses getting
> on to your machine. Just don't do it. Lots of other alternatives
> including Mozilla and Yahoo.
> 3) Reduce your use of Internet Explorer. IE is still an attractive
> target for hackers. Don't make yourself a target.
>
> I don't run anti-virus software under XP. Doing the three things I've
> listed above (and not running arbitrary exe's from the 'net) removes
> virtually all of my exposure to external compromise. If there is some
> new kind of vulnerability that hackers discover, I might have to change
> things a bit, so I check security advisories occasionally to see what
> the bastards are currently up to.
>
> This went on a bit longer than I expected it to, but hopefully some of
> it was useful. I could go on about the rest of a developer's environment
> (e.g. chair, desk, whiteboard, lighting, sound, distractions,
> headphones, music selection :-) but I'm going to try out this thing
> called RealLife v1.0: It is Saturday night, after all...
>
> ciao,
> -xbytor
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| Re: hardware for development [message #164568 is a reply to message #164218] |
Tue, 15 June 2004 10:49 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: benjamin.schallar.com
Hi!
Although I will upgrade my Thinkpad R40 to 1GiB RAM, I [yet] found no
solution to connect a CRT to it (using it in 'xinerama'-mode under
win2k, that is extending the usable desktop to it).
I have a 19" and a 20" CRT and I'd love to use them for coding, but I
found no graphiccard that would have a dual-output and would work for
any kind of notebook (e.g. via usb2, firewire or even pcmcia).
Do you know of any kind of external gfx-card [preferably with dual-out
for two CRTs]?
Thanks!
- Benjamin
xbytor wrote:
> Bruce Gordon wrote:
> [...]
>
> Monitors should also be at least 19" and 1280x1024 minimum resolution.
> If you can't have both and your eyesight is ok, go with a 17". Right
> now I've got an LCD, but that's just because it generates far less heat
> and weighs a lot less than a CRT of the same size.
>
> [...]
> ciao,
> -xbytor
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