Assumption:
This set of notes is taken in reference to the presentation and discussion during the F2F meeting. It is recommended that you use these notes in conjunction with the actual presentation slides and the agenda.
Attendees:
Recent Success (Harm)
- 3.0.1.1 by the end of this week (Oct 1st)
- Workbench downstream will have two weeks afterward for testing
- Plan to close all open defects by the end of the year
- 3.2 iteration will trim one week of coding (for the coming holidays)
- Overall, the process is improving
- Caution: too many (re)open streams (3.0.1.1, 3.1, 3.2) resulting in resource constraints
Project creation review (Tyler)
- PMC
- Eclipse representation
- Group membership
- Committer
o Need a link between the project lead and committers (Mike)
- Meeting frequency
o Want to align with Eclipse board meeting
- Want to keep the current CVS structure and naming (Harm)
o Package names still refer to Hyades instead of TPTP
o Keep Hyades naming to avoid breaking binary compatibility
- Branding issues of Eclipse, Hyades and consumer’s perception
- Concensus: migrate the name from Hyades to TPTP
- IBM needs the existing naming until Q1’05 for the current release
ACTION: Need too restructure/re-factor the mailing lists and news groups for better responses
o Project leads to send proposed names for the new mail and news groups to Tyler. One mailing list and news group per project and TPTP,
- All committer’s access and TPTP administrative requests should now be forwarded to Tyler for approval (instead of Tools PMC Lead)
ACTION: Tyler to close with John D. with approval rights to TPTP CVS and webpages.
Eclipse Marketing Vision (Ian)
- How to raise awareness of
o Eclipse is more than just a Java-IDE
o IDE for non-Java development (e.g. C/C++)
- Java-IDE people can refer developers to TPTP
Marketing Group (Ling Yao)
- Ling to talk to Teresa, Gartner analyst, regarding to Eclipse and TPTP
regarding to open-source model
- Why participate Linux World
o Out of the box Hyades can be used effectively as part of the open source stack (Linux, JBoss, mySQL, etc.)
- Should we participate in Test & Performance conferences (Ian)?
EPL from CPL (Harm)
- EPL is created mainly to address the liability issue
- Simpler process because committers belong to a limited number of companies
- Plan to convert to all EPL with Eclipse 3.1 (Q2’05)
- Can both EPL & CPL claims be in the same file/content?
o Dual licenses during the transition?
- What about JUnit under GPL?
o Ask the provider to agree or separate out the packages
Outreach (Tyler)
- HP and Quest have shown interest in joining
- Early talks with Ericsson, Nokia, QnX
- Re-engage with companies that have dropped off (e.g. Parasoft)
- Adopting Hyades
o For testing
o For monitoring
- Certification
o Use TPTP to automate the certification of Eclipse plug-ins
o Third party tool or service to oversee the certification program
- Eclipse Computing Infrastructure
o Plan to use Hyades & BIRT for monitoring and reporting
o This will be more just exemplary tools which will require resource allocation (Harm).
- Should we have a new sub-project for monitoring where the data may not go back to Eclipse workbench like headless data collection?
o This is already within the scope of TPTP
- Licensed agent?
- Align with other projects:
o BIRT: TPTP will have BIRT as prereq
o ECOMM: focus at the desktop collaboration level and not really overlap with TPTP at the technical level. Need more engineering discussion to align and leverage TPTP infrastructure.
Eclipse Councils (Tyler)
- The groups try to provide guidance and not dictate what sub-groups must do
- The council could go out and seek additional members and resources to accommodate the plan
- How often does the council set the plan? Twice a year (?)
- There is an elapsed period between plan proposal and approval. This assumes things are moving along based upon prior plans.
- Has the structure had the potential of process-oriented overweight? We will adjust the structure accordingly if there is a need.
Attendees:
8.30 –
TPTP Requirements Group Overview by Mike Norman
Mike presented the Eclipse Foundation structures and processes for requirements gathering. TPTP charter has the requirements group. All members of RG are consumers (even those who are committers and contributors).
Mike expressed the concern that there is no mechanism/process for tracking requirements across multiple projects. If there is a requirement on another project that TPTP needs to deliver on one its requirements, there is no mechanism in place to know what is done to the requirement through various stages – adoption, design, implementation, release and etc. It was also pointed out that TPTP and some other projects were doing a good job having a transparent process to handle requirements, but there are projects that don’t have a process. There was lot of discussion on this and consensus is that we need to better.
ACTION: Mike to monitor how well cross dependencies are handled for the next development cycle and see if we need to drive a discussion about process at Eclipse Requirements Council to address this deficiency.
Themes & Priorities from members: All members are invited to present requirements and priorities to address the needs of consuming tools from within their organizations.
Jim Saliba:
1. Test Management:
Unit testing using JUNIT and others. Reuse unit tests in functional tests.
integrating test assets through life stages, reporting (coverage etc.)
2. Integrating v/s interfacing: We can not integrate everything? Need to support interfacing to external testing tools. Example: run some test scripts on a remote machine for an external testing tool.
3. Register extensions for machine types (virtual or physical) that would provide ability to provide scripts and commands that are tailored for the machine type.
4. Monitoring:
Data Collection includes monitoring of counters & meters and notification of monitoring data dynamically.
Analysis and Event Handling:
5. Marathon, LoadRunner, Grinder ( an open source stress test tool) and other UI testing tools.
A. Hoffman from Fokus
Andrews presented TTCN-3 tools integration to Hyades. Serge pointed out that use of execution events is recommended rather than logging of CBE for execution history.
Don Ebright from Compuware
Don would like to see generalization of the VMware requirement to analysis and configuration of a VM image before booting it.
It is desirable to converge to a common meta-model for monitoring events that most application servers and system monitors.
Andrews mentioned that there is an OMG standard (Deployment and configuration of Dist. Sys. http://www.omg.org/docs/mars/03-03-04.pdf ) that is similar.
ACTION: Don to follow with starting a forum with TPTP to discuss and come to consensus on the common meta-model for application delivery services and shoot for a spec/scope document to coincide with one of the point releases.
Gian Franco from SAP
Compliance Points (extension points that a TPTP compliant implementation/adaptation should provide)
Intel and IBM requirements are already in Bugzilla and in the draft document posed on Eclipse.org
Team deliberated on potential themes for TPTP and converged on the following:
TPTP Architecture Group Overview by Harm Sluiman
Harm reviewed charter of TPTP architecture group (modeled after Eclipse Architecture Council). Reported summary of outcomes from recent Eclipse Architecture Council.
TPTP has a strong interest in promoting XSD from a technology subproject to under tools project. We depend on it and would like to see it established firmly as a Eclipse project.
Team discussed criteria for carving out current set of plugins/component from Hyades into four new projects – Platform, Test, Trace Profiling, and Monitoring. The consensus was that any piece that is used or specialized by more than one of the three non-platform projects, it should be left in the Platform project. There is concern (minority view) that Platform is not a true platform, but more a collection of core components. A draft proposal for partitioning Hyades components to the four projects is prepared and will be open for two more days for members to review before being posted publicly.
ACTION: Team to review the proposed mapping of existing components/plugins to four projects under TPTP. (Harm to post the proposal on the Hyades webpage by Friday.
Day 3: Thursday September 29, 2004 Meeting Minutes
Attendees:
1. Update project roadmap and project plan
2. Define/plan project restructuring
The discussed and agreed to the following way to restructure the following activities that are addressed at the present time in the weekly committer call.
|
Commiter Call |
Project |
Cross-Project (PG) |
Arch. Group |
|
Defect/Features/Testing Tracking |
X |
X |
- |
|
Builds, smoke and integration tests CVS Admin – branches & etc. |
- |
X |
- |
|
Design/Code Review – arch alignment |
- |
- |
X |
|
TPTP self-hosting (drive as a set of features) |
- |
- |
- |
|
Plan & Schedule Tracking |
X |
X |
- |
|
Packaging |
- |
X |
- |
|
Testing |
X |
- |
- |
Next, the group discussed TPTP road map and alignment with EP roadmap. TPTP 3.x releases are based on EP 3.0.x releases and TPTP 4.x releases are based on EP3.1.x releases.
Compatibility: Backward binary compatibility should be preserved in releases under a major release number (e.g., 3.x). The plugins working for a 3.x release should not be required to be rebuilt for another 3.x release. There may be a need for API enhancing/breaking major release mid next year as 4.0. When breaking APIs, need to deprecate the existing APIs but continue to support them for a few releases, so that old plugins must be buildable under new release. Every effort must be made to preserve backward compatibility for binaries (of existing plugins).
Meeting structure going forward: Restructuring of current Hyades project and related meeting activities will result in some new meetings. There is a desire to co-locate the TPTP QM with EC QM. This will help reduce the travel for many who travel to both the meetings. We will try to align the next quarterly meeting with EC quarterly at end of November 2004. Each group and project within TPTP can schedule and conduct meetings at each body’s discretion. However, RG ->AG->PG should complete their work prior to the TPTP quarterly meeting; especially produce the draft material needed by the depending group, so that they can complete their work within a week.
Going forward:
Architecture Group every 6 wks
Requirements Group every 6 wks
Planning Group Meeting every 6 wks
TPTP Coordination Meeting every 1 wks
TPTP Quarterly every 3 months
Additional Eclipse Council Meetings:
EC Quarterly every 3 months
EC Monthly (RC, AC, PC) via phone
ACTION: Tyler to follow up on feasibility of co-locating TPTP QM with EC QM
Ø overlapping TPTP and EC meetings or shorten from 3 to 2 days
Ø cost of meeting facilities as we can not leverage member company facilities.
Planning for TPTP 3.2 Release
ACTIONS: