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in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 13:56 Go to next message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi,
what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
is a list of ....")

(The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").

Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?

Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?

A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
build case?

Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:

repositories {
svn repository helios3.5 {
baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
// other settings...
}
// additional repositories
}

Regards
- henrik
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #528978 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
I have seen the term "stream" used in relationship to these words - but
wikipedia defines that it is typically used to denote something like
"container of a branch/trunk". A "timestamp" does not have the feel of a
"stream".

regards
- henrik

On 4/22/10 3:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #528994 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hm, one mistake on my part - a revision or timestamp naturally refers to
the entire repository, so this must be separate from "baselines".


On 4/22/10 3:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #528995 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thomas Hallgren is currently offline Thomas HallgrenFriend
Messages: 3229
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On 04/22/2010 03:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
That's a modified truth. The branchTagPath in Buckminster can contain branches or tags. Not revisions nor timestamps.
They are referred to as "version selectors" which admittedly is a bit confusing.

There is however a point in keeping them separate since you may look at a specific revision or timestamp of a branch.
Some systems may even allow that you create tags on branches (p4 and ClearCase for instance).

I like to view a branch as something that moves. It has revisions and it always has a head. The trunk (or main) is just
another branch.

A revision, tag, or timestamp, is a snapshot of a branch. Some systems (like CVS) will not support all combinations but
in general I think that semantic is OK.

The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far
nobody has complained about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better job.


> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
Yes it would.

> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
Revision is far too loaded. It has a very specific meaning in both SVN and Git.

> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
A baseline to me is when you bring several things together, possibly form several repositories and branches, according
to a spec. That spec is a "baseline". I think that is also how it's referenced in ClearCase.

> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
I think we should stick with branches, tags, revisions, and timestamps and explicitly specify what is what. These are
well known concepts so why invent a new (and common) name for them?

I think that what's needed is a way to specify a branch with an optional snapshot qualifier (tag, timestamp, or
revision). If we say that the default branch is called main, then referencing the tag "release3" would need two arguments:

main { tag = release3 }

we could also have a generic moving tag that represents the head of the branch:

main { tag = LATEST }

and set that equal to just

main

Your example, switching the term baselines for branches, would then be written:

branches main, Platform-3.5.x, main { tag = release3 };

Spelled out it would be:

branches main { tag = LATEST }, Platform-3.5.x { tag = LATEST }, main { tag = release3 };


Regards,
Thomas Hallgren
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #529002 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eike Stepper is currently offline Eike StepperFriend
Messages: 5574
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Henrik,

In CDO repositories we just introduced the concept of branching. To look
at the repository contents (here: object graph) consistently one needs a
CDOView and that is configured with a CDOBranchPoint. Such a "branch
point" is a point in time in a particular branch. There are special
branch points that denote the "base" and the "head" of a branch. A "tag"
is just a named branch point.

BTW. a CDORevision is really different from an SVN revision.

Cheers
/Eike

----
http://thegordian.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/eikestepper



Am 22.04.2010 15:56, schrieb Henrik Lindberg:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list?
> ("It is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is
> a non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in
> the build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #529003 is a reply to message #528995] Thu, 22 April 2010 15:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks Thomas,
the syntax you proposed works fine for me - and the common concept that
I was searching for is "branches" (which works when taking out the stuff
that should not be there (timestamps, revisions).

Will come back with a grammar proposal.

- henrik

On 4/22/10 4:43 PM, Thomas Hallgren wrote:
> On 04/22/2010 03:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
>> Hi,
>> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
>> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
>> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
>> is a list of ....")
>>
>> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>>
> That's a modified truth. The branchTagPath in Buckminster can contain
> branches or tags. Not revisions nor timestamps. They are referred to as
> "version selectors" which admittedly is a bit confusing.
>
> There is however a point in keeping them separate since you may look at
> a specific revision or timestamp of a branch. Some systems may even
> allow that you create tags on branches (p4 and ClearCase for instance).
>
> I like to view a branch as something that moves. It has revisions and it
> always has a head. The trunk (or main) is just another branch.
>
> A revision, tag, or timestamp, is a snapshot of a branch. Some systems
> (like CVS) will not support all combinations but in general I think that
> semantic is OK.
>
> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
> job.
>
>
>> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
>> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>>
> Yes it would.
>
>> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>>
> Revision is far too loaded. It has a very specific meaning in both SVN
> and Git.
>
>> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
>> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
>> build case?
>>
> A baseline to me is when you bring several things together, possibly
> form several repositories and branches, according to a spec. That spec
> is a "baseline". I think that is also how it's referenced in ClearCase.
>
>> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>>
>> repositories {
>> svn repository helios3.5 {
>> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
>> // other settings...
>> }
>> // additional repositories
>> }
>>
> I think we should stick with branches, tags, revisions, and timestamps
> and explicitly specify what is what. These are well known concepts so
> why invent a new (and common) name for them?
>
> I think that what's needed is a way to specify a branch with an optional
> snapshot qualifier (tag, timestamp, or revision). If we say that the
> default branch is called main, then referencing the tag "release3" would
> need two arguments:
>
> main { tag = release3 }
>
> we could also have a generic moving tag that represents the head of the
> branch:
>
> main { tag = LATEST }
>
> and set that equal to just
>
> main
>
> Your example, switching the term baselines for branches, would then be
> written:
>
> branches main, Platform-3.5.x, main { tag = release3 };
>
> Spelled out it would be:
>
> branches main { tag = LATEST }, Platform-3.5.x { tag = LATEST }, main {
> tag = release3 };
>
>
> Regards,
> Thomas Hallgren
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #529004 is a reply to message #529002] Thu, 22 April 2010 15:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks Eike, that fits with what Thomas proposed.
- henrik

On 4/22/10 4:54 PM, Eike Stepper wrote:
> Hi Henrik,
>
> In CDO repositories we just introduced the concept of branching. To look
> at the repository contents (here: object graph) consistently one needs a
> CDOView and that is configured with a CDOBranchPoint. Such a "branch
> point" is a point in time in a particular branch. There are special
> branch points that denote the "base" and the "head" of a branch. A "tag"
> is just a named branch point.
>
> BTW. a CDORevision is really different from an SVN revision.
>
> Cheers
> /Eike
>
> ----
> http://thegordian.blogspot.com
> http://twitter.com/eikestepper
>
>
>
> Am 22.04.2010 15:56, schrieb Henrik Lindberg:
>> Hi,
>> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
>> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
>> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list?
>> ("It is a list of ....")
>>
>> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>>
>> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
>> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>>
>> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>>
>> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is
>> a non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in
>> the build case?
>>
>> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>>
>> repositories {
>> svn repository helios3.5 {
>> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
>> // other settings...
>> }
>> // additional repositories
>> }
>>
>> Regards
>> - henrik
>>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #529717 is a reply to message #528995] Mon, 26 April 2010 22:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bernhard Merkle is currently offline Bernhard MerkleFriend
Messages: 88
Registered: July 2009
Member
On 22.04.2010 16:43, Thomas Hallgren wrote:

> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
> job.
I am not so happy with branchTagPath as it mixes up two different
idioms. Branch is more ongoing parallel development while at Tag is
fixed and should not be moved/modified at all. To they are contrary.

However I have not a better term ATM ;/ (What about VersionURL or
VersionURI ?)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control chapter Common vocabulary
has some good definitions. However there is no generalized unique term
for specifying a revision via tag/branch/timestamp across VCS...


regards,
Berni.
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #529722 is a reply to message #529717] Mon, 26 April 2010 23:10 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Bernhard,
After some discussion we concluded that we really did not need a
"unified term" as they are indeed different concepts (as you point out).

What I am implementing in b3 uses the term "branch" and it is possible
to further specify that a particular tag, revision, timestamp or the
symbolic 'latest' should be picked from said branch. And just as in
Buckminster, there is a symbolic 'main' branch, and if nothing else but
the repository is specified "main latest" is assumed.

This works conceptually for both classic SCMs like CVS/SVN as well as
Git (although there are restrictions regarding what can be combined for
a given SCM technology).

Regards
- henrik

On 4/27/10 12:24 AM, Bernhard Merkle wrote:
> On 22.04.2010 16:43, Thomas Hallgren wrote:
>
>> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
>> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
>> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
>> job.
> I am not so happy with branchTagPath as it mixes up two different
> idioms. Branch is more ongoing parallel development while at Tag is
> fixed and should not be moved/modified at all. To they are contrary.
>
> However I have not a better term ATM ;/ (What about VersionURL or
> VersionURI ?)
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control chapter Common vocabulary
> has some good definitions. However there is no generalized unique term
> for specifying a revision via tag/branch/timestamp across VCS...
>
>
> regards,
> Berni.
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603768 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:24 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
I have seen the term "stream" used in relationship to these words - but
wikipedia defines that it is typically used to denote something like
"container of a branch/trunk". A "timestamp" does not have the feel of a
"stream".

regards
- henrik

On 4/22/10 3:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603772 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:37 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hm, one mistake on my part - a revision or timestamp naturally refers to
the entire repository, so this must be separate from "baselines".


On 4/22/10 3:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603776 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:43 Go to previous message
Thomas Hallgren is currently offline Thomas HallgrenFriend
Messages: 3229
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On 04/22/2010 03:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
> is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
That's a modified truth. The branchTagPath in Buckminster can contain branches or tags. Not revisions nor timestamps.
They are referred to as "version selectors" which admittedly is a bit confusing.

There is however a point in keeping them separate since you may look at a specific revision or timestamp of a branch.
Some systems may even allow that you create tags on branches (p4 and ClearCase for instance).

I like to view a branch as something that moves. It has revisions and it always has a head. The trunk (or main) is just
another branch.

A revision, tag, or timestamp, is a snapshot of a branch. Some systems (like CVS) will not support all combinations but
in general I think that semantic is OK.

The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far
nobody has complained about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better job.


> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
Yes it would.

> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
Revision is far too loaded. It has a very specific meaning in both SVN and Git.

> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
> build case?
>
A baseline to me is when you bring several things together, possibly form several repositories and branches, according
to a spec. That spec is a "baseline". I think that is also how it's referenced in ClearCase.

> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
I think we should stick with branches, tags, revisions, and timestamps and explicitly specify what is what. These are
well known concepts so why invent a new (and common) name for them?

I think that what's needed is a way to specify a branch with an optional snapshot qualifier (tag, timestamp, or
revision). If we say that the default branch is called main, then referencing the tag "release3" would need two arguments:

main { tag = release3 }

we could also have a generic moving tag that represents the head of the branch:

main { tag = LATEST }

and set that equal to just

main

Your example, switching the term baselines for branches, would then be written:

branches main, Platform-3.5.x, main { tag = release3 };

Spelled out it would be:

branches main { tag = LATEST }, Platform-3.5.x { tag = LATEST }, main { tag = release3 };


Regards,
Thomas Hallgren
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603779 is a reply to message #528963] Thu, 22 April 2010 14:54 Go to previous message
Eike Stepper is currently offline Eike StepperFriend
Messages: 5574
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Henrik,

In CDO repositories we just introduced the concept of branching. To look
at the repository contents (here: object graph) consistently one needs a
CDOView and that is configured with a CDOBranchPoint. Such a "branch
point" is a point in time in a particular branch. There are special
branch points that denote the "base" and the "head" of a branch. A "tag"
is just a named branch point.

BTW. a CDORevision is really different from an SVN revision.

Cheers
/Eike

----
http://thegordian.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/eikestepper



Am 22.04.2010 15:56, schrieb Henrik Lindberg:
> Hi,
> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list?
> ("It is a list of ....")
>
> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>
> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>
> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>
> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is
> a non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in
> the build case?
>
> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>
> repositories {
> svn repository helios3.5 {
> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
> // other settings...
> }
> // additional repositories
> }
>
> Regards
> - henrik
>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603781 is a reply to message #528995] Thu, 22 April 2010 15:01 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks Thomas,
the syntax you proposed works fine for me - and the common concept that
I was searching for is "branches" (which works when taking out the stuff
that should not be there (timestamps, revisions).

Will come back with a grammar proposal.

- henrik

On 4/22/10 4:43 PM, Thomas Hallgren wrote:
> On 04/22/2010 03:56 PM, Henrik Lindberg wrote:
>> Hi,
>> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
>> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
>> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list? ("It
>> is a list of ....")
>>
>> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>>
> That's a modified truth. The branchTagPath in Buckminster can contain
> branches or tags. Not revisions nor timestamps. They are referred to as
> "version selectors" which admittedly is a bit confusing.
>
> There is however a point in keeping them separate since you may look at
> a specific revision or timestamp of a branch. Some systems may even
> allow that you create tags on branches (p4 and ClearCase for instance).
>
> I like to view a branch as something that moves. It has revisions and it
> always has a head. The trunk (or main) is just another branch.
>
> A revision, tag, or timestamp, is a snapshot of a branch. Some systems
> (like CVS) will not support all combinations but in general I think that
> semantic is OK.
>
> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
> job.
>
>
>> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
>> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>>
> Yes it would.
>
>> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>>
> Revision is far too loaded. It has a very specific meaning in both SVN
> and Git.
>
>> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is a
>> non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in the
>> build case?
>>
> A baseline to me is when you bring several things together, possibly
> form several repositories and branches, according to a spec. That spec
> is a "baseline". I think that is also how it's referenced in ClearCase.
>
>> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>>
>> repositories {
>> svn repository helios3.5 {
>> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
>> // other settings...
>> }
>> // additional repositories
>> }
>>
> I think we should stick with branches, tags, revisions, and timestamps
> and explicitly specify what is what. These are well known concepts so
> why invent a new (and common) name for them?
>
> I think that what's needed is a way to specify a branch with an optional
> snapshot qualifier (tag, timestamp, or revision). If we say that the
> default branch is called main, then referencing the tag "release3" would
> need two arguments:
>
> main { tag = release3 }
>
> we could also have a generic moving tag that represents the head of the
> branch:
>
> main { tag = LATEST }
>
> and set that equal to just
>
> main
>
> Your example, switching the term baselines for branches, would then be
> written:
>
> branches main, Platform-3.5.x, main { tag = release3 };
>
> Spelled out it would be:
>
> branches main { tag = LATEST }, Platform-3.5.x { tag = LATEST }, main {
> tag = release3 };
>
>
> Regards,
> Thomas Hallgren
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #603785 is a reply to message #529002] Thu, 22 April 2010 15:01 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks Eike, that fits with what Thomas proposed.
- henrik

On 4/22/10 4:54 PM, Eike Stepper wrote:
> Hi Henrik,
>
> In CDO repositories we just introduced the concept of branching. To look
> at the repository contents (here: object graph) consistently one needs a
> CDOView and that is configured with a CDOBranchPoint. Such a "branch
> point" is a point in time in a particular branch. There are special
> branch points that denote the "base" and the "head" of a branch. A "tag"
> is just a named branch point.
>
> BTW. a CDORevision is really different from an SVN revision.
>
> Cheers
> /Eike
>
> ----
> http://thegordian.blogspot.com
> http://twitter.com/eikestepper
>
>
>
> Am 22.04.2010 15:56, schrieb Henrik Lindberg:
>> Hi,
>> what is a good term to use for concepts like branch, tag, timestamp,
>> revision, trunk? Assume you have a list of names identifying a mix of
>> such things - what would you like to use as the type of that list?
>> ("It is a list of ....")
>>
>> (The current term for the entire list in Buckminster is "branchTagPath").
>>
>> Would it bother you if they are referred to as "branches" even if some
>> of them are more of a "snapshot" nature?
>>
>> Is "view" or "revisions" a good term?
>>
>> A blessed 'whatchemmicallit' is usually referred to as "baseline" - is
>> a non-blessed simply a "line", or is the term "baseline" applicable in
>> the build case?
>>
>> Right now I am in favor of "baseline", and can imagine syntax like this:
>>
>> repositories {
>> svn repository helios3.5 {
>> baselines main, "Platform-3.5.x", /release3;
>> // other settings...
>> }
>> // additional repositories
>> }
>>
>> Regards
>> - henrik
>>
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #606039 is a reply to message #528995] Mon, 26 April 2010 22:24 Go to previous message
Bernhard Merkle is currently offline Bernhard MerkleFriend
Messages: 88
Registered: July 2009
Member
On 22.04.2010 16:43, Thomas Hallgren wrote:

> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
> job.
I am not so happy with branchTagPath as it mixes up two different
idioms. Branch is more ongoing parallel development while at Tag is
fixed and should not be moved/modified at all. To they are contrary.

However I have not a better term ATM ;/ (What about VersionURL or
VersionURI ?)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control chapter Common vocabulary
has some good definitions. However there is no generalized unique term
for specifying a revision via tag/branch/timestamp across VCS...


regards,
Berni.
Re: in search for a term - opinions wanted [message #606045 is a reply to message #529717] Mon, 26 April 2010 23:10 Go to previous message
Henrik Lindberg is currently offline Henrik LindbergFriend
Messages: 2500
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Bernhard,
After some discussion we concluded that we really did not need a
"unified term" as they are indeed different concepts (as you point out).

What I am implementing in b3 uses the term "branch" and it is possible
to further specify that a particular tag, revision, timestamp or the
symbolic 'latest' should be picked from said branch. And just as in
Buckminster, there is a symbolic 'main' branch, and if nothing else but
the repository is specified "main latest" is assumed.

This works conceptually for both classic SCMs like CVS/SVN as well as
Git (although there are restrictions regarding what can be combined for
a given SCM technology).

Regards
- henrik

On 4/27/10 12:24 AM, Bernhard Merkle wrote:
> On 22.04.2010 16:43, Thomas Hallgren wrote:
>
>> The Buckminster branchTagPath was based on the assumption that you
>> either want a branch or a tag, never both. So far nobody has complained
>> about that but when designing a new system I think we should do a better
>> job.
> I am not so happy with branchTagPath as it mixes up two different
> idioms. Branch is more ongoing parallel development while at Tag is
> fixed and should not be moved/modified at all. To they are contrary.
>
> However I have not a better term ATM ;/ (What about VersionURL or
> VersionURI ?)
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control chapter Common vocabulary
> has some good definitions. However there is no generalized unique term
> for specifying a revision via tag/branch/timestamp across VCS...
>
>
> regards,
> Berni.
>
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