Home » Eclipse Projects » Eclipse Platform » Multiple Tab Rows, Please
| Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #216807] |
Sat, 27 March 2004 21:09  |
Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: foo.blah.com
I just finished reading over the new features in 3.0 M8, and
I have to say I'm a little frustrated after reading the
"solution" to managing a large number of tabs. In short,
IntelliJ has this right, and Eclipse does not. IntelliJ's
solution is to let the user choose how many rows you want
dedicated to editor tabs. Frankly, I'll happily dedicate a
few rows of horizontal space to tabs for all the source
files I have open.
The addition of the "chevron with a drop down list" is nice,
but it is still inadequate. Tabs are still useless more
often than not, with ctrl-F6 generally being the quickest
way for switching.
Why not have multiple tab rows?
-Jon
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| Re: Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #216900 is a reply to message #216887] |
Sun, 28 March 2004 09:41  |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: foo.blah.com
Johan Compagner wrote:
> CTRL-E is the fasted way of switching now i believe..
>
> johan
With the current state of tabs, that's usually the case.
However, with tabs done the IntelliJ way, I can simply see
the tab I want and click on it. That's faster than opening
a dialog and possibly scrolling through it or typing the
first few letters of the file.
But let's say we have a faster way of switching editors.
Does this mean that tabs should scale poorly? Of course
not. If you're going to have tabs, you might as well make
them as functional as possible. And from what I've seen,
the best solution to tab scalability are multiple rows of
tabs. Doing it column-wise might be even better.
-Jon
>
>
> Jon Newton wrote:
>
>> I just finished reading over the new features in 3.0 M8, and I have to
>> say I'm a little frustrated after reading the "solution" to managing a
>> large number of tabs. In short, IntelliJ has this right, and Eclipse
>> does not. IntelliJ's solution is to let the user choose how many rows
>> you want dedicated to editor tabs. Frankly, I'll happily dedicate a
>> few rows of horizontal space to tabs for all the source files I have
>> open.
>>
>> The addition of the "chevron with a drop down list" is nice, but it is
>> still inadequate. Tabs are still useless more often than not, with
>> ctrl-F6 generally being the quickest way for switching.
>>
>> Why not have multiple tab rows?
>>
>>
>> -Jon
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| Re: Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #216956 is a reply to message #216900] |
Sun, 28 March 2004 11:56 |
| Eclipse User |
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I had this same gripe in a build not long after M7. I like tabs. I don't
like one tab with the full name in it. That is what a mouse over is for. I
do agree having tons of tiny tabs sucks, but I would be willing to give up a
couple rows of editing to have a couple rows of tabs if I have that many
files open. The built in Java/Swing tab control does this automatically and
it is common in various OSs to see a similar control if too many tabs for
the dialog, for example, to fit on one row. So I am surprised (again) with
the SWT "native" stuff that it doesn't act that way. I too would like to see
the option to have multiple rows of tabs OR put the arrows back in, I liked
that better as well and it too was more standard than what is there now.
"Jon Newton" <foo@blah.com> wrote in message
news:c46nso$pg8$1@eclipse.org...
> Johan Compagner wrote:
> > CTRL-E is the fasted way of switching now i believe..
> >
> > johan
>
> With the current state of tabs, that's usually the case.
> However, with tabs done the IntelliJ way, I can simply see
> the tab I want and click on it. That's faster than opening
> a dialog and possibly scrolling through it or typing the
> first few letters of the file.
>
> But let's say we have a faster way of switching editors.
> Does this mean that tabs should scale poorly? Of course
> not. If you're going to have tabs, you might as well make
> them as functional as possible. And from what I've seen,
> the best solution to tab scalability are multiple rows of
> tabs. Doing it column-wise might be even better.
>
> -Jon
>
> >
> >
> > Jon Newton wrote:
> >
> >> I just finished reading over the new features in 3.0 M8, and I have to
> >> say I'm a little frustrated after reading the "solution" to managing a
> >> large number of tabs. In short, IntelliJ has this right, and Eclipse
> >> does not. IntelliJ's solution is to let the user choose how many rows
> >> you want dedicated to editor tabs. Frankly, I'll happily dedicate a
> >> few rows of horizontal space to tabs for all the source files I have
> >> open.
> >>
> >> The addition of the "chevron with a drop down list" is nice, but it is
> >> still inadequate. Tabs are still useless more often than not, with
> >> ctrl-F6 generally being the quickest way for switching.
> >>
> >> Why not have multiple tab rows?
> >>
> >>
> >> -Jon
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| Re: Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #216972 is a reply to message #216937] |
Sun, 28 March 2004 12:53 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: foo.blah.com
Ian Lang wrote:
> I'll disagree with you on this. Rows of tabs should be avoided like the
> plague. Any time UI elements move around without a customer explicitly
> moving them there is something wrong and people are going to get confused.
> That is why Microsoft's experiment in dynamically adjusting people menus
> based on what they used most often was a failure.
I don't think that analogy applies. The problem with
microsoft's feature is that things you expected to see
simply disapeared. If you were hunting through their maze
of menus, you had the extra task of exploding collapsed
areas to find what you're looking for.
In fact, I would say that the chevron is *far* closer to
Microsoft's feature than multiple tab rows. Suddenly, you
have to look two places for a class you are editing,
potentialy having to "explode" the chevron if you don't see
it in the tabs.
Multiple tab rows don't behave any differently than a single
row other than you have more tabs visible at once. In fact,
I'd like to hear how your analogy applies to 3 rows of tabs
but doesnt apply to 1 row of tabs?
> I have no experience with IntelliJ but I for one do not like rows of tabs
> and I think Eclipse has it about as good as it gets. In Eclipse 2.x the
> tabs shrank until it was impossible to read any file names now the tabs
> always show the file name and the chevron allows access to all the other
> tabs. What else can you ask for?
I'd ask for three tab rows and a chevron instead of one tab
row and a chevron. Why not give the user the option of
saying how many lines get dedicated to tab rows? I have yet
to see an IntelliJ user leave that at one row.
I'd also like to be able to hide the file extension in the
tabs when working with a homogenous project. I don't need
to see ".java" with every class I'm working on. It's a
waste of space and it reduces the number of tabs I can see
by about 30% or so.
Don't get me wrong, Eclipse is an amazing editor and I think
it is THE editor to use for Java. If I didn't like it, I
wouldn't take the time to make suggestions for it.
-Jon
>
> IL
>
>
> Jon Newton wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>In short,
>>IntelliJ has this right, and Eclipse does not. IntelliJ's
>>solution is to let the user choose how many rows you want
>>dedicated to editor tabs.
>
> <snip>
>
>>Why not have multiple tab rows?
>
> <snip>
>
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| Re: Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #217107 is a reply to message #217057] |
Sun, 28 March 2004 20:34 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: foo.blah.com
Ian Lang wrote:
> One row of tabs works well because when you click on a tab the only thing
> that happens is that tab's editor comes to the front. What causes a
> problem with three rows, for example, is that when you click on a tab in
> the second or third row the world shifts under your mouse. While the
> chosen editor does come to the front the tab under the mouse changes and
> none of the tabs are where they were before. That creates a disconcerting
> feeling in the UI which is something you do not want.
Ah, I'm not at all suggesting that selecting a tab causes
any sort of rearrengment. I would say that clicking a tab
should simply pull up that file in the editor. Tab ordering
would remain unchanged as would row ordering. If I click a
tab in the bottom row, that row remains on the bottom. This
is how it works in IntelliJ, I believe.
Now, I have seen some UIs with the tab behaviour you
describe, and Iagree that such behavior is ridiculous and
confusing to the user. That is not at all what I'm
suggesting, though.
>
> I see your point about some tabs disappearing into the chevron - I had not
> though of it that way. I prefer the chevron to the scrolling arrow
> buttons because it is much easier to get the editor you want with a drop
> down than have to scroll an unknown distance with those buttons.
>
I totally agree. The chevron is much better than the
scrolling arrows.
-Jon
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| Re: Multiple Tab Rows, Please [message #219289 is a reply to message #219074] |
Wed, 31 March 2004 10:19 |
| Eclipse User |
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Originally posted by: eclipse.rizzoweb.com
Jon Skeet wrote:
> For one thing I'd ask for the ability to turn off icons and filename
> extensions in the tab display. In fact, I *have* asked for that in a
> bug report :)
>
> I've also even patched the 2.1 code to support it... I suspect I'll end
> up doing the same for 3.0 :(
>
You did attach your patch to the bug report, didn't you? I've seen more
than one occasion where the Eclipse developers accepted a working patch
from users and incorporated it into the product. If it works as
advertised and doesn't break anything, it makes their job easier.
Eric
True love is like ghosts, which everyone talks about but few have
actually seen.
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