Removing remove [message #719984] |
Mon, 29 August 2011 15:50 |
Hernan Gonzalez Messages: 188 Registered: October 2010 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
Senior Member |
|
|
In Graphiti Remove only gets rid of the graphical element, while Delete also removes the business object.
I don't know if this distinction is more or less standard, but I know that it's a little puzzling to me - I wonder if also for the user ("toolsmith" or "practitioner") :
1. I can never remember which one is which. To me (perhaps because I'm not a native english speaker) "delete" and "remove", as verbs, are synonyms. Rather, "delete" evokes to me some graphical context.
2. It seems strange to me that, in normal use, one would like to "remove" (alter only the graphical element ; I believe that almost always we want the graph to be in synch with the model). Given that, it seems unfortunate to me that this action is prominently exposed to the user, in the default configuration (both in the standard menus and in the contextual menu).
3. Further, this "feature" is not very straigforward to disable. Because, as Graphiti features, one depends on the other. Indeed this question (see the last post) has still no satisfactory answer. (And I'm interested in it)
In the standard/default configuration a user cannot perform an "Add" without performing also a "Create". Similarly, it would appear more logic that the "remove" feature should not be exposed in the menus.
|
|
|
|
Re: Removing remove [message #720083 is a reply to message #720078] |
Mon, 29 August 2011 20:48 |
Hernan Gonzalez Messages: 188 Registered: October 2010 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina |
Senior Member |
|
|
Andreas Graf wrote on Mon, 29 August 2011 17:20Hi Hernan,
the remove/delete dichotomy is something that applies to all graphical modelling tools. It is just something that users have to learn for each tool. The graph is only always in sync with the model if you do not have multiple views on the model. Consider an UML tool where you have multiple diagrams for the same model. It is not easy to decide wether to remove the element from the model or just from the view. IMHO it is essential to have that menu entry for anything other than the simplest tools.
Thanks, Andreas. I agree that some graphical editors need to work with a "partial view" of the model; but it's also common (I'd say more, but I won't dispute that) to have a one-to-one correspondence (what the user see in the diagram is all that he has). This has little to do with the editor being simple or sophisticated, it's another scenario.
And (see from the other thread I linked) it's not only me who needs to remove the "remove feature" from the gui (menu, contextual menu, key binding), and it's currently very difficult to do so because internally the remove feature is called by the delete feature.
And in Eclipse-RCP it's easy to add GUI contributions as extension points but it's difficult to remove contributions added by another plugin.
[Updated on: Mon, 29 August 2011 20:50] Report message to a moderator
|
|
|
Re: Removing remove [message #720240 is a reply to message #720083] |
Tue, 30 August 2011 07:54 |
Michael Wenz Messages: 1931 Registered: July 2009 Location: Walldorf, Germany |
Senior Member |
|
|
Hernan,
I just posted an answer to to the thread you mentioned. Thanks for bringing
this back onto my radar...
Michael
"Hernan" schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:j3gt9i$qis$1@news.eclipse.org...
Andreas Graf wrote on Mon, 29 August 2011 17:20
> Hi Hernan,
>
> the remove/delete dichotomy is something that applies to all graphical
> modelling tools. It is just something that users have to learn for each
> tool. The graph is only always in sync with the model if you do not have
> multiple views on the model. Consider an UML tool where you have multiple
> diagrams for the same model. It is not easy to decide wether to remove the
> element from the model or just from the view. IMHO it is essential to have
> that menu entry for anything other than the simplest tools.
Thanks, Andreas. I agree that some graphical editors need to work with a
"partial view" of the model; but it's also common (I'd say more, but I won't
dispute that) to have a one-to-one correspondence (what the user see in the
diagram is all that he has). This has little to do with the editor being
simple or sophisticated, it's another scenario.
And (see from the other thread I linked) it's not only me who needs to
remove the "remove feature" from the gui (menu, contextual menu, key
binding), and it's currently very difficult to do so because internally the
remove feature is called by the delete feature.
|
|
|
|
|
Powered by
FUDForum. Page generated in 0.02850 seconds