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Home » Eclipse Projects » 4DIAC - Framework for Distributed Industrial Automation and Control » build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS
build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810521] Tue, 13 August 2019 06:58 Go to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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is it difficult to build a forte based on a PLC not in the lists of the online document, which i don't know the CPU and operation system. For example,the plc is delta dvp-14ss2
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810529 is a reply to message #1810521] Tue, 13 August 2019 08:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Martin Melik-Merkumians is currently offline Martin Melik-MerkumiansFriend
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If you don't know the CPU and the OS it is practically impossible, as you need this information for the compilation process (e.g. which compiler you need). Also you need this for the needed adaptions of FORTE's HAL.

Besides, if you do not have even this basic information, how have you planned to put a theoretically compiled FORTE on the PLC?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810543 is a reply to message #1810529] Tue, 13 August 2019 10:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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can we use bacnet with register mapping to archive that? For some plc system are sealed, not so open to client

[Updated on: Tue, 13 August 2019 10:16]

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Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810548 is a reply to message #1810543] Tue, 13 August 2019 11:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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I had a quick look on the PLC you've mentioned. I think for that you would need the support of the vendor. Other PLCs which are a bit more open it is rather easy. As we ported 4diac FORTE to many devices I can say, when the information Martin mentions, is available it is pretty straight forward.

The other option that is also often considered is to run 4diac FORTE on another device and use some legacy communication to interact with the existing PLC. This has some advantages especially in an brownfield environment. 4diac FORTE is rather flexible and can easily be extended with different communication protocols. For your example with bacnet I can say that there is currently a Bachelor's thesis under work at TU Vienna which is exactly working on that.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810552 is a reply to message #1810548] Tue, 13 August 2019 11:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Thanks a lot, Mr. Zoitl, i am very appreciated you give us so much help!
so take Mitsubishi for example, it is not included in online document,
how to build a forte for that, can you tell me the steps, thanks!

[Updated on: Tue, 13 August 2019 12:09]

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Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810571 is a reply to message #1810552] Tue, 13 August 2019 15:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Mr. Zoitl, we decide to use forte in our project, with Mitsubishi PLC, can you please give a advice on which serial can be used for forte?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810576 is a reply to message #1810571] Tue, 13 August 2019 15:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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I have done first experiments with an older version of the C Controller CPU module. I've just been on the web-page of Mitsubishi Electric and it looks like the have an update version of this CPU module of the MELSEC iQ-R Series [1]. What I could see when I briefly looked over the page is that 4diac FORTE should be pretty easy to port to the module. We already have vxWorks support so this can be used as starting point. The only thing that would need a bit of work would be to implement the code for accessing the IOs. But according to the text on the web-page there is a library provided for that.

Anyhow we are very interested in expanding our hardware support. So if you have 4diac FORTE running on currently not listed hardware we are happy to hear about your experience. Also if you have ports to hardware you like to contribute let us know. Finally we are also helping to port.

Cheers,
Alois

[1] https://www.mitsubishielectric.com/fa/products/cnt/plcr/pmerit/cpu/c_cont.html
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810581 is a reply to message #1810576] Tue, 13 August 2019 16:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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That is excellent, thank you very much!
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810597 is a reply to message #1810581] Wed, 14 August 2019 06:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Mr. Zoitl,
I have one more question,
we can only use MELSEC iQ-R Series, and
other series like
MELSEC iQ-F Series
MELSEC-Q Series
MELSEC-L Series
MELSEC-F Series
MELSEC-QS/WS Series
MELSEC-A Series

can not be used with forte, am i right ?
and any document to build forte on vxworks?

[Updated on: Wed, 14 August 2019 06:46]

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Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810598 is a reply to message #1810597] Wed, 14 August 2019 07:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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I did only a qick search and this was the MELESEC iQ-R Series showed me the first with a C-Controller CPU. For quick results you need a CPU where Mitsubishi Electric allows you to run C++ programs. If you find CPUs from the other series which allows that than you can use them too. If you are ensure feel free to post links here. For the other we would need support from Mitsubishi Electric. But if that is available I think it would be possible. Does anybody here in the forum have contacts to Mitsubishi Electric to ask?

Not sure if we have any docs. However building for vxWorks should be pretty straight forward. You need the Windriver gcc tool-chain for the controller. For the rest our CMake files should be take care of and the result should be a loadable vxWorks module.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810601 is a reply to message #1810598] Wed, 14 August 2019 07:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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We should build the forte on vxworks' virtual machine, can't build it directly on windows?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810602 is a reply to message #1810601] Wed, 14 August 2019 07:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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You always do cross compiling on Windows for vxWorks.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810607 is a reply to message #1810602] Wed, 14 August 2019 08:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Mr. Zoitl, it took me a long time, but i can't find the Windriver gcc tool-chain where to download it.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810638 is a reply to message #1810607] Wed, 14 August 2019 21:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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AFAIK the tool chain is not freely available. Also you need to correct one for your controller. So best is you check with the PLC vendor on that.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810657 is a reply to message #1810638] Thu, 15 August 2019 10:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Mr. Zoitl, I contact with Mitsubishi local supprt, it is said, we should buy the CW workbench license, is that right?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810675 is a reply to message #1810657] Thu, 15 August 2019 18:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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What I can read on the Mitsubishi web-site I would say yes.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810757 is a reply to message #1810675] Mon, 19 August 2019 10:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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Mr. Zoitl, if we want to implement the cross compiling with vxworks, how do we set the cmake, should we use MinWG makefiles and select option "specify toolchain file for cross compiling" ? that's a bit complex for us.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810758 is a reply to message #1810757] Mon, 19 August 2019 10:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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and where to set the enviroment WIND_BASE
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810765 is a reply to message #1810758] Mon, 19 August 2019 12:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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adn the FORTE_VXWORKS_ARCHITECTURE default value is pentium, should we keep it as it is ?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810835 is a reply to message #1810765] Tue, 20 August 2019 10:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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I found the file under forte-incubation_1.10.2\src\arch\vxworks\support\vxworksToDo.txt
i am trying.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810839 is a reply to message #1810835] Tue, 20 August 2019 11:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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follow the instruction, it's succeded. thanks to Mr. Jose Cabral and Mr. Zoitl !
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810862 is a reply to message #1810839] Tue, 20 August 2019 20:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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great to hear. Sorry I was not looking into the forum over the last days.
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810867 is a reply to message #1810862] Wed, 21 August 2019 05:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joy woo is currently offline joy wooFriend
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but this cpu and vxworks only support C programming, without IEC61131(Ladder, ST) support.
So is Wago PFC the best choice so far for Forte?
Re: build a forte in PLC not in list of already supported PLCS [message #1810910 is a reply to message #1810867] Wed, 21 August 2019 17:04 Go to previous message
Alois Zoitl is currently offline Alois ZoitlFriend
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this is hard to say in general I would say each of the supported devices have their pros and cons. And I definitely I would love that we support much more of them.
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