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Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #9029] Mon, 01 September 2008 11:32 Go to next message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi all Riena-users,

August has been a time with a lot of changes, refactorings and new features that we are now publishing as the Milestone
M4 (awaited by some people).

It was uploaded this morning so some mirrors are still syncing, but you can already get it from some of the download
servers.

This time we have a very detailed long list of changes, so we put it on a seperate wiki page for you to read
http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 . It contains text, small code samples and some screen shot fragments.

This time we have a combined Windows and Mac release so you should be able to use this version with Windows and Mac.

Instructions for Download, Install and your first steps can be (as usual) found here
http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Getting_started.

We have also update the Riena wizard as mentioned in the Getting started so it generates code that works with M4
http://download1.eclipse.org/rt/riena/updatesites/org.eclips e.riena.ui.templates.updatesite (dont try this URL in your
browser it wont work, Eclipse appends site.xml to the URL and THAT will work).

Code generated with the previous version of Riena (M3) wont work with the new version.

We hope that we have reached a pretty good stage with this release and have less API changes in the future. (maybe some
class renamings)

As usual if you have trouble, have questions and or have anything to say, just post it here. We love to hear from you.

thanks
christian campo
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #9050 is a reply to message #9029] Mon, 01 September 2008 15:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Christian Campo schrieb:
> Hi all Riena-users,
>
> August has been a time with a lot of changes, refactorings and new
> features that we are now publishing as the Milestone M4 (awaited by some
> people).
;-)

>
> It was uploaded this morning so some mirrors are still syncing, but you
> can already get it from some of the download servers.
>
> This time we have a very detailed long list of changes, so we put it on
> a seperate wiki page for you to read
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 . It contains text,
> small code samples and some screen shot fragments.
>
> This time we have a combined Windows and Mac release so you should be
> able to use this version with Windows and Mac.
>
> Instructions for Download, Install and your first steps can be (as
> usual) found here http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Getting_started.
>

just replaced Riena M4 in my target platform and all works as before,
the only one I found (Bugzilla 245880):
org.eclipse.riena.ui.ridgets requires a specific
org.apache.commons.beanutils bundle
But I'm already using beanutils from springsource enterprise repository.
....would be great if you can change this into import package.

> We have also update the Riena wizard as mentioned in the Getting started
> so it generates code that works with M4

this works, too


>
> We hope that we have reached a pretty good stage with this release and
> have less API changes in the future. (maybe some class renamings)
>
> As usual if you have trouble, have questions and or have anything to
> say, just post it here. We love to hear from you.
>

no trouble - only the question if there's something more documentation
about the Riena Ridgets, markers, validation, databinding etc.

the Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 is worthful, but there you talk about
changes and enhancements which could only 'understand' from developers
of Riena knowing the whole concepts and architecture - but hard to
understand from developers outside the Riena universe

of course I have to study the code and snippets to see and learn what
you're doing. but a real documentation would be great.

thanks that I can now use 'normal' RCP Views together with Riena -
this will help much. ...so my next steps will be to see what parts of
SWTDesigner can I use and what not. I imagine that I shouldn't use
databinding from SWTDesigner.
If you have some do's and don'ts or HowTos.... would be helpful

in the meantime: thanks for your great tool and thanks for all the
enhancements and changes you've done since M3. this makes me really
feeling good about Riena

ekke
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #9070 is a reply to message #9050] Mon, 01 September 2008 15:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
ekke schrieb:
> Christian Campo schrieb:
>> Hi all Riena-users,
>>
>> August has been a time with a lot of changes, refactorings and new
>> features that we are now publishing as the Milestone M4 (awaited by
>> some people).
> ;-)
>
>>
>> It was uploaded this morning so some mirrors are still syncing, but
>> you can already get it from some of the download servers.
>>
>> This time we have a very detailed long list of changes, so we put it
>> on a seperate wiki page for you to read
>> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 . It contains
>> text, small code samples and some screen shot fragments.
>>
>> This time we have a combined Windows and Mac release so you should be
>> able to use this version with Windows and Mac.
>>
>> Instructions for Download, Install and your first steps can be (as
>> usual) found here http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Getting_started.
>>
>
> just replaced Riena M4 in my target platform and all works as before,
> the only one I found (Bugzilla 245880):
> org.eclipse.riena.ui.ridgets requires a specific
> org.apache.commons.beanutils bundle
> But I'm already using beanutils from springsource enterprise repository.
> ...would be great if you can change this into import package.
>
>> We have also update the Riena wizard as mentioned in the Getting
>> started so it generates code that works with M4
>
> this works, too
>
>
>>
>> We hope that we have reached a pretty good stage with this release and
>> have less API changes in the future. (maybe some class renamings)
>>
>> As usual if you have trouble, have questions and or have anything to
>> say, just post it here. We love to hear from you.
>>
>
> no trouble - only the question if there's something more documentation
> about the Riena Ridgets, markers, validation, databinding etc.
>
> the Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 is worthful, but there you talk about
> changes and enhancements which could only 'understand' from developers
> of Riena knowing the whole concepts and architecture - but hard to
> understand from developers outside the Riena universe
>
> of course I have to study the code and snippets to see and learn what
> you're doing. but a real documentation would be great.
>
> thanks that I can now use 'normal' RCP Views together with Riena -
> this will help much. ...so my next steps will be to see what parts of
> SWTDesigner can I use and what not. I imagine that I shouldn't use
> databinding from SWTDesigner.
> If you have some do's and don'ts or HowTos.... would be helpful
>
> in the meantime: thanks for your great tool and thanks for all the
> enhancements and changes you've done since M3. this makes me really
> feeling good about Riena
>
> ekke
hi ekke,

thanks for your quick response. Highly appreciated.

As for documentation we have so many testcases I just counted and saw 818 testcases and 427 UI testcases only testing
Ridgets, Validation, Databinding etc. That is at least a good starting point :-). Our next step will to enhance the code
snippet section of Riena http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Snippets and have many more entries that show all the various
ways to use Riena ridgets.

So we managed to start our little sub-project "modular Riena" which is focused on allowing people to use only part of
the Riena UI (as you are doing it). The next milestone will further investigate what the best approach is if you use
SWT Designer, how to use Riena Views in RCP applications and vica version, howto embed an RCP view in a Riena
application. So we document our progress through posts as we go along. Using SWT Designers is something you shouldnt do
if you like to use Ridgets :-).

We will not really finished bound hardcover book on how to use Riena :-), but we plan on having more documentation.
Currently many new things were brought in and we got a little uncertain about namings. So we gonna change probably some
of the classnames because currently in some parts its even complicated for us to understand.

So simplicity is a good goal but we are not there yet.

But I think we come very far already and that also thank to your bug reports every now and then....thanks for that....

christian
just for the record [message #9131 is a reply to message #9029] Tue, 02 September 2008 07:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
I just noticed some statistics about Riena which I like to share.

M4 has 942 Java classes, 818 JUnit Tests of which 427 are UI JUnit Tests.

not a bad test coverage I believe

christian campo
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #11961 is a reply to message #9029] Fri, 19 September 2008 19:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi,

The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
Windows/Mac users:
http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip

The

download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?

Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly
the available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and
getting familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind
something more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is
more convenient.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #11973 is a reply to message #11961] Fri, 19 September 2008 21:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
> Windows/Mac users:
> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip
>
>
> The
> download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
> OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?
>
> Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
> an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly the
> available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and getting
> familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind something
> more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is more convenient.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
joel,
I'm using RienaM4 on OSX (developing a pure OSGI client/server ERP solution)

IDE: Ganymede RCP + SWT Designer + Riena UI Wizard + jbpm + drools + quantum

TargetPlatform: RCP + Equinox + Riena + Easybeans (OSGI EJB Container) +
some bundles from SpringSourceEnterpriseBundleRepository

(from Riena download I'm using only:
- com.caucho.hessian
- org.eclipse.riena.*)

just working on a sample server how to make it all run
still need some days to document it all and make it ready-to-go

I'll post to the list if its available

BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target
platform

ekke
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #11985 is a reply to message #11973] Sat, 20 September 2008 09:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
On 2008-09-19 22:25:49 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:

Hi ekke,

Thanks for your reply...

> joel,
> I'm using RienaM4 on OSX (developing a pure OSGI client/server ERP solution)

What I was noting, and I should have made clearer, is that none of the
UI dependent samples run.

> IDE: Ganymede RCP + SWT Designer + Riena UI Wizard + jbpm + drools + quantum
>
> TargetPlatform: RCP + Equinox + Riena + Easybeans (OSGI EJB Container)
> + some bundles from SpringSourceEnterpriseBundleRepository

This is the part that I am actually interested in. I am really only
interested in the OSGI server of Rieana to use as the basis the ORMF
server.

>
> (from Riena download I'm using only:
> - com.caucho.hessian
> - org.eclipse.riena.*)

That helps tremendously to get me started.

> just working on a sample server how to make it all run
> still need some days to document it all and make it ready-to-go
>
> I'll post to the list if its available

I will watch for it, thanks.

> BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target platform

I am aware that this is the "correct" way to do it, and I simply do not
agree. Well at least not until eclipse has tooling in place to make
adding features and updates to the target automated. I have been there
and done that and the amount of effort going into getting all of the
(some times conflicting) dependencies sorted for a complex environment
can be very exhausting. I had to put one project together that using
RCP+BIRT+EMF and it was less than fun. I do understand the advantage of
not co-mixing but for now I will live the downside as the lesser of two
evils. And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
"perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #11998 is a reply to message #11985] Sat, 20 September 2008 10:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> On 2008-09-19 22:25:49 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:
>
> Hi ekke,
>
> Thanks for your reply...
.....
>
>> BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target
>> platform
>
> I am aware that this is the "correct" way to do it, and I simply do not
> agree. Well at least not until eclipse has tooling in place to make
> adding features and updates to the target automated. I have been there
> and done that and the amount of effort going into getting all of the
> (some times conflicting) dependencies sorted for a complex environment
> can be very exhausting. I had to put one project together that using
> RCP+BIRT+EMF and it was less than fun.

I know - its not easy and really no fun ;-)
if I'm having some time I'll take a look at P2 - think there must be a
way to use P2 to organize updating of a target platform

I do understand the advantage of
> not co-mixing but for now I will live the downside as the lesser of two
> evils.

both ways are not ideal until tooling supports target platforms well -
and until target platforms can be used on a per-project-base (chris
aniszczyk blogged about this some time ago - but I think it will not be
there before e4)

And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
> "perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.
>
not always ;-)
sometimes exporting is confused by 3rdParty bundles with cycles

ekke
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12011 is a reply to message #11998] Sat, 20 September 2008 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
On 2008-09-20 11:08:16 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:

> And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
>> "perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.
>>
> not always ;-)
> sometimes exporting is confused by 3rdParty bundles with cycles

I have not yet experienced this, but I have no doubt you are correct.
Yet I would venture to guess that the tooling manages to get confused
less frequently than I do :-)

Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12050 is a reply to message #11961] Sun, 21 September 2008 18:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Sorry that part of the documentation is misleading and is probably there because M3 only supported Mac and Windows and
platform dependant. Linux is a target for Riena but we havnt come around to address it....

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
> Windows/Mac users:
> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip
>
>
> The
> download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
> OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?
>
> Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
> an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly the
> available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and getting
> familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind something
> more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is more convenient.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12138 is a reply to message #12050] Sun, 28 September 2008 16:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi,

I am trying to get a functional environment to start building a Riena
server and I am running into a few quite basic issues. I am still on
the steep slope of the learning curve, so please bear with me a bit.

First thing, I am working on Mac OS X (10.5.5) which is probably making
it bit more difficult as M4 we seems to be packaged on for WinDose.

The steps that I have gone through to build a target is:
1. install the RCP SPK for Ganymede 3.4
2. copy the org.riena.* plug-ins from Riena 1.0.0 M4 to the RCP
target's plugin folder
3. copy the the riena features into the target's feature folder
4. install the eclipse-equinox-SDK-3.4.zip into the target
5. launch an Eclipse Ganymede SDK
6. set the PDE target platform to the target just built
7. import all of the Riena samples

Low and behold there are problems with the build because
1. org.eclipse.equinox.log.Logger can not be found. Which is accurate
it is not in org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.v20080414.jar
2. unknown extension point org.eclipse.core.variables.valueVariables

A bit of investigation has indicated that Riena is using
org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.HEAD.jar which does have the Logger
class. Does this mean that it is not possible to use the standard
Equinox distribution?

It would be very helpful to have a cook book of exactly what is needed
to create a target environment. In particular, I would personally like
to see that be two sets of instructions. One for what is needed for
just the server and remoting and a second for the entire Riena system.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12152 is a reply to message #12138] Mon, 29 September 2008 05:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> I am trying to get a functional environment to start building a Riena
> server and I am running into a few quite basic issues. I am still on the
> steep slope of the learning curve, so please bear with me a bit.
>
> First thing, I am working on Mac OS X (10.5.5) which is probably making
> it bit more difficult as M4 we seems to be packaged on for WinDose.
>

no, joel,

I can confirm that there's no problem using OSX
I'm using riena only under OSX 10.5.5
....and I know some of the Riena developers, too are using OSX

> The steps that I have gone through to build a target is:
> 1. install the RCP SPK for Ganymede 3.4
> 2. copy the org.riena.* plug-ins from Riena 1.0.0 M4 to the RCP
> target's plugin folder
you also have to copy com.caucho.hessian
and in your target there should be a bundle exporting log4j

> 3. copy the the riena features into the target's feature folder
> 4. install the eclipse-equinox-SDK-3.4.zip into the target
> 5. launch an Eclipse Ganymede SDK
> 6. set the PDE target platform to the target just built
> 7. import all of the Riena samples
>
> Low and behold there are problems with the build because
> 1. org.eclipse.equinox.log.Logger can not be found. Which is
> accurate it is not in org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.v20080414.jar
> 2. unknown extension point org.eclipse.core.variables.valueVariables
>

you have to replace the 'standard' equiniox log bundle by the .HEAD
bundle from Riena distribution (or from eclipse cvs)

> A bit of investigation has indicated that Riena is using
> org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.HEAD.jar which does have the Logger class.
> Does this mean that it is not possible to use the standard Equinox
> distribution?
>
yes - at the moment
but Riena is in incubation
and equinox is also working on logging
(see Simons comment to
http://ekkes-corner.blogspot.com/2008/09/logging-in-osgi-ent erprise-applications.html
)
and the HEAD version is compatible with the 'normal' log bundle

ekke
> It would be very helpful to have a cook book of exactly what is needed
> to create a target environment. In particular, I would personally like
> to see that be two sets of instructions. One for what is needed for just
> the server and remoting and a second for the entire Riena system.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12163 is a reply to message #12152] Mon, 29 September 2008 08:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi Ekke,

Thanks once again. I did get it up and running but I was getting a bit
frustrated with the fussing :-( thus the post.

What I would suggest to make Riena more approachable to new users is an
OS agnostic install that could be added to an RCP SDK.

Also thanks for the pointer to the Logging blog, I have perused it and
will actually read it later in the day. Good stuff!

Many thanks,
Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #12922 is a reply to message #12163] Mon, 29 September 2008 09:14 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi Ekke,
>
> Thanks once again. I did get it up and running

GREAT !

but I was getting a bit
> frustrated with the fussing :-( thus the post.
>
> What I would suggest to make Riena more approachable to new users is an
> OS agnostic install that could be added to an RCP SDK.
>

yes - would make things easier for newcomers

> Also thanks for the pointer to the Logging blog, I have perused it and
> will actually read it later in the day. Good stuff!
>
today part 2 will come out ...

ekke
> Many thanks,
> Joel
>
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #573957 is a reply to message #9029] Mon, 01 September 2008 15:28 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Christian Campo schrieb:
> Hi all Riena-users,
>
> August has been a time with a lot of changes, refactorings and new
> features that we are now publishing as the Milestone M4 (awaited by some
> people).
;-)

>
> It was uploaded this morning so some mirrors are still syncing, but you
> can already get it from some of the download servers.
>
> This time we have a very detailed long list of changes, so we put it on
> a seperate wiki page for you to read
> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 . It contains text,
> small code samples and some screen shot fragments.
>
> This time we have a combined Windows and Mac release so you should be
> able to use this version with Windows and Mac.
>
> Instructions for Download, Install and your first steps can be (as
> usual) found here http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Getting_started
>

just replaced Riena M4 in my target platform and all works as before,
the only one I found (Bugzilla 245880):
org.eclipse.riena.ui.ridgets requires a specific
org.apache.commons.beanutils bundle
But I'm already using beanutils from springsource enterprise repository.
....would be great if you can change this into import package.

> We have also update the Riena wizard as mentioned in the Getting started
> so it generates code that works with M4

this works, too


>
> We hope that we have reached a pretty good stage with this release and
> have less API changes in the future. (maybe some class renamings)
>
> As usual if you have trouble, have questions and or have anything to
> say, just post it here. We love to hear from you.
>

no trouble - only the question if there's something more documentation
about the Riena Ridgets, markers, validation, databinding etc.

the Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 is worthful, but there you talk about
changes and enhancements which could only 'understand' from developers
of Riena knowing the whole concepts and architecture - but hard to
understand from developers outside the Riena universe

of course I have to study the code and snippets to see and learn what
you're doing. but a real documentation would be great.

thanks that I can now use 'normal' RCP Views together with Riena -
this will help much. ...so my next steps will be to see what parts of
SWTDesigner can I use and what not. I imagine that I shouldn't use
databinding from SWTDesigner.
If you have some do's and don'ts or HowTos.... would be helpful

in the meantime: thanks for your great tool and thanks for all the
enhancements and changes you've done since M3. this makes me really
feeling good about Riena

ekke
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #573985 is a reply to message #9050] Mon, 01 September 2008 15:50 Go to previous message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
ekke schrieb:
> Christian Campo schrieb:
>> Hi all Riena-users,
>>
>> August has been a time with a lot of changes, refactorings and new
>> features that we are now publishing as the Milestone M4 (awaited by
>> some people).
> ;-)
>
>>
>> It was uploaded this morning so some mirrors are still syncing, but
>> you can already get it from some of the download servers.
>>
>> This time we have a very detailed long list of changes, so we put it
>> on a seperate wiki page for you to read
>> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 . It contains
>> text, small code samples and some screen shot fragments.
>>
>> This time we have a combined Windows and Mac release so you should be
>> able to use this version with Windows and Mac.
>>
>> Instructions for Download, Install and your first steps can be (as
>> usual) found here http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Getting_started
>>
>
> just replaced Riena M4 in my target platform and all works as before,
> the only one I found (Bugzilla 245880):
> org.eclipse.riena.ui.ridgets requires a specific
> org.apache.commons.beanutils bundle
> But I'm already using beanutils from springsource enterprise repository.
> ...would be great if you can change this into import package.
>
>> We have also update the Riena wizard as mentioned in the Getting
>> started so it generates code that works with M4
>
> this works, too
>
>
>>
>> We hope that we have reached a pretty good stage with this release and
>> have less API changes in the future. (maybe some class renamings)
>>
>> As usual if you have trouble, have questions and or have anything to
>> say, just post it here. We love to hear from you.
>>
>
> no trouble - only the question if there's something more documentation
> about the Riena Ridgets, markers, validation, databinding etc.
>
> the Riena_New_And_Noteworthy#M4 is worthful, but there you talk about
> changes and enhancements which could only 'understand' from developers
> of Riena knowing the whole concepts and architecture - but hard to
> understand from developers outside the Riena universe
>
> of course I have to study the code and snippets to see and learn what
> you're doing. but a real documentation would be great.
>
> thanks that I can now use 'normal' RCP Views together with Riena -
> this will help much. ...so my next steps will be to see what parts of
> SWTDesigner can I use and what not. I imagine that I shouldn't use
> databinding from SWTDesigner.
> If you have some do's and don'ts or HowTos.... would be helpful
>
> in the meantime: thanks for your great tool and thanks for all the
> enhancements and changes you've done since M3. this makes me really
> feeling good about Riena
>
> ekke
hi ekke,

thanks for your quick response. Highly appreciated.

As for documentation we have so many testcases I just counted and saw 818 testcases and 427 UI testcases only testing
Ridgets, Validation, Databinding etc. That is at least a good starting point :-). Our next step will to enhance the code
snippet section of Riena http://wiki.eclipse.org/Riena_Snippets and have many more entries that show all the various
ways to use Riena ridgets.

So we managed to start our little sub-project "modular Riena" which is focused on allowing people to use only part of
the Riena UI (as you are doing it). The next milestone will further investigate what the best approach is if you use
SWT Designer, how to use Riena Views in RCP applications and vica version, howto embed an RCP view in a Riena
application. So we document our progress through posts as we go along. Using SWT Designers is something you shouldnt do
if you like to use Ridgets :-).

We will not really finished bound hardcover book on how to use Riena :-), but we plan on having more documentation.
Currently many new things were brought in and we got a little uncertain about namings. So we gonna change probably some
of the classnames because currently in some parts its even complicated for us to understand.

So simplicity is a good goal but we are not there yet.

But I think we come very far already and that also thank to your bug reports every now and then....thanks for that....

christian
just for the record [message #574079 is a reply to message #9029] Tue, 02 September 2008 07:14 Go to previous message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
I just noticed some statistics about Riena which I like to share.

M4 has 942 Java classes, 818 JUnit Tests of which 427 are UI JUnit Tests.

not a bad test coverage I believe

christian campo
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #574920 is a reply to message #9029] Fri, 19 September 2008 19:21 Go to previous message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi,

The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
Windows/Mac users:
http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip

The

download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?

Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly
the available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and
getting familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind
something more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is
more convenient.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #574945 is a reply to message #11961] Fri, 19 September 2008 21:25 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
> Windows/Mac users:
> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip
>
>
> The
> download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
> OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?
>
> Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
> an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly the
> available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and getting
> familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind something
> more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is more convenient.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
joel,
I'm using RienaM4 on OSX (developing a pure OSGI client/server ERP solution)

IDE: Ganymede RCP + SWT Designer + Riena UI Wizard + jbpm + drools + quantum

TargetPlatform: RCP + Equinox + Riena + Easybeans (OSGI EJB Container) +
some bundles from SpringSourceEnterpriseBundleRepository

(from Riena download I'm using only:
- com.caucho.hessian
- org.eclipse.riena.*)

just working on a sample server how to make it all run
still need some days to document it all and make it ready-to-go

I'll post to the list if its available

BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target
platform

ekke
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #574965 is a reply to message #11973] Sat, 20 September 2008 09:42 Go to previous message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
On 2008-09-19 22:25:49 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:

Hi ekke,

Thanks for your reply...

> joel,
> I'm using RienaM4 on OSX (developing a pure OSGI client/server ERP solution)

What I was noting, and I should have made clearer, is that none of the
UI dependent samples run.

> IDE: Ganymede RCP + SWT Designer + Riena UI Wizard + jbpm + drools + quantum
>
> TargetPlatform: RCP + Equinox + Riena + Easybeans (OSGI EJB Container)
> + some bundles from SpringSourceEnterpriseBundleRepository

This is the part that I am actually interested in. I am really only
interested in the OSGI server of Rieana to use as the basis the ORMF
server.

>
> (from Riena download I'm using only:
> - com.caucho.hessian
> - org.eclipse.riena.*)

That helps tremendously to get me started.

> just working on a sample server how to make it all run
> still need some days to document it all and make it ready-to-go
>
> I'll post to the list if its available

I will watch for it, thanks.

> BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target platform

I am aware that this is the "correct" way to do it, and I simply do not
agree. Well at least not until eclipse has tooling in place to make
adding features and updates to the target automated. I have been there
and done that and the amount of effort going into getting all of the
(some times conflicting) dependencies sorted for a complex environment
can be very exhausting. I had to put one project together that using
RCP+BIRT+EMF and it was less than fun. I do understand the advantage of
not co-mixing but for now I will live the downside as the lesser of two
evils. And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
"perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #574996 is a reply to message #11985] Sat, 20 September 2008 10:08 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> On 2008-09-19 22:25:49 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:
>
> Hi ekke,
>
> Thanks for your reply...
.....
>
>> BTW: from my point-of-view its always good to separate IDE from target
>> platform
>
> I am aware that this is the "correct" way to do it, and I simply do not
> agree. Well at least not until eclipse has tooling in place to make
> adding features and updates to the target automated. I have been there
> and done that and the amount of effort going into getting all of the
> (some times conflicting) dependencies sorted for a complex environment
> can be very exhausting. I had to put one project together that using
> RCP+BIRT+EMF and it was less than fun.

I know - its not easy and really no fun ;-)
if I'm having some time I'll take a look at P2 - think there must be a
way to use P2 to organize updating of a target platform

I do understand the advantage of
> not co-mixing but for now I will live the downside as the lesser of two
> evils.

both ways are not ideal until tooling supports target platforms well -
and until target platforms can be used on a per-project-base (chris
aniszczyk blogged about this some time ago - but I think it will not be
there before e4)

And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
> "perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.
>
not always ;-)
sometimes exporting is confused by 3rdParty bundles with cycles

ekke
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575020 is a reply to message #11998] Sat, 20 September 2008 10:50 Go to previous message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
On 2008-09-20 11:08:16 +0100, ekke <ekkehard@gentz-software.de> said:

> And at least the PDE tooling does a great job at exporting a
>> "perfect" deliverable that contains exactly what is required.
>>
> not always ;-)
> sometimes exporting is confused by 3rdParty bundles with cycles

I have not yet experienced this, but I have no doubt you are correct.
Yet I would venture to guess that the tooling manages to get confused
less frequently than I do :-)

Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575097 is a reply to message #11961] Sun, 21 September 2008 18:27 Go to previous message
Christian Campo is currently offline Christian CampoFriend
Messages: 590
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Sorry that part of the documentation is misleading and is probably there because M3 only supported Mac and Windows and
platform dependant. Linux is a target for Riena but we havnt come around to address it....

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> The "Getting Started" page for M4 indicates:
> Windows/Mac users:
> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/download.php?file=/rt/riena /Riena-1.0.0.M4-incubator-platform.zip
>
>
> The
> download, however, does not contain any of the Carbon specific jars nor
> OS X start ups etc. Am I missing the point?
>
> Also, I was wondering if there is a packaging that can be dropped into
> an existing Ganymede rather than using a separate target. Certainly the
> available platform is very useful for playing with Riena and getting
> familiar, but as soon as one wants to actually start buildind something
> more serious simply adding Riena to an existing Eclipse is more convenient.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575267 is a reply to message #12050] Sun, 28 September 2008 16:16 Go to previous message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi,

I am trying to get a functional environment to start building a Riena
server and I am running into a few quite basic issues. I am still on
the steep slope of the learning curve, so please bear with me a bit.

First thing, I am working on Mac OS X (10.5.5) which is probably making
it bit more difficult as M4 we seems to be packaged on for WinDose.

The steps that I have gone through to build a target is:
1. install the RCP SPK for Ganymede 3.4
2. copy the org.riena.* plug-ins from Riena 1.0.0 M4 to the RCP
target's plugin folder
3. copy the the riena features into the target's feature folder
4. install the eclipse-equinox-SDK-3.4.zip into the target
5. launch an Eclipse Ganymede SDK
6. set the PDE target platform to the target just built
7. import all of the Riena samples

Low and behold there are problems with the build because
1. org.eclipse.equinox.log.Logger can not be found. Which is accurate
it is not in org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.v20080414.jar
2. unknown extension point org.eclipse.core.variables.valueVariables

A bit of investigation has indicated that Riena is using
org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.HEAD.jar which does have the Logger
class. Does this mean that it is not possible to use the standard
Equinox distribution?

It would be very helpful to have a cook book of exactly what is needed
to create a target environment. In particular, I would personally like
to see that be two sets of instructions. One for what is needed for
just the server and remoting and a second for the entire Riena system.

Many thanks,
Joel
--
Joel Rosi-Schwartz
Etish Limited [http://www.etish.org]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
^...^
/ o,o \ The proud parents of Useme & ORMF
|) ::: (| Open Requirements Management Framework
====w=w==== [http://www.eclipse.org/ormf/]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575318 is a reply to message #12138] Mon, 29 September 2008 05:10 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi,
>
> I am trying to get a functional environment to start building a Riena
> server and I am running into a few quite basic issues. I am still on the
> steep slope of the learning curve, so please bear with me a bit.
>
> First thing, I am working on Mac OS X (10.5.5) which is probably making
> it bit more difficult as M4 we seems to be packaged on for WinDose.
>

no, joel,

I can confirm that there's no problem using OSX
I'm using riena only under OSX 10.5.5
....and I know some of the Riena developers, too are using OSX

> The steps that I have gone through to build a target is:
> 1. install the RCP SPK for Ganymede 3.4
> 2. copy the org.riena.* plug-ins from Riena 1.0.0 M4 to the RCP
> target's plugin folder
you also have to copy com.caucho.hessian
and in your target there should be a bundle exporting log4j

> 3. copy the the riena features into the target's feature folder
> 4. install the eclipse-equinox-SDK-3.4.zip into the target
> 5. launch an Eclipse Ganymede SDK
> 6. set the PDE target platform to the target just built
> 7. import all of the Riena samples
>
> Low and behold there are problems with the build because
> 1. org.eclipse.equinox.log.Logger can not be found. Which is
> accurate it is not in org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.v20080414.jar
> 2. unknown extension point org.eclipse.core.variables.valueVariables
>

you have to replace the 'standard' equiniox log bundle by the .HEAD
bundle from Riena distribution (or from eclipse cvs)

> A bit of investigation has indicated that Riena is using
> org.eclipse.equinox.log_1.1.0.HEAD.jar which does have the Logger class.
> Does this mean that it is not possible to use the standard Equinox
> distribution?
>
yes - at the moment
but Riena is in incubation
and equinox is also working on logging
(see Simons comment to
http://ekkes-corner.blogspot.com/2008/09/logging-in-osgi-ent erprise-applications.html
)
and the HEAD version is compatible with the 'normal' log bundle

ekke
> It would be very helpful to have a cook book of exactly what is needed
> to create a target environment. In particular, I would personally like
> to see that be two sets of instructions. One for what is needed for just
> the server and remoting and a second for the entire Riena system.
>
> Many thanks,
> Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575336 is a reply to message #12152] Mon, 29 September 2008 08:44 Go to previous message
Joel Rosi-Schwartz is currently offline Joel Rosi-SchwartzFriend
Messages: 624
Registered: July 2009
Location: London. England
Senior Member
Hi Ekke,

Thanks once again. I did get it up and running but I was getting a bit
frustrated with the fussing :-( thus the post.

What I would suggest to make Riena more approachable to new users is an
OS agnostic install that could be added to an RCP SDK.

Also thanks for the pointer to the Logging blog, I have perused it and
will actually read it later in the day. Good stuff!

Many thanks,
Joel
Re: Riena 1.0.0.M4 [message #575374 is a reply to message #12163] Mon, 29 September 2008 09:14 Go to previous message
Eclipse UserFriend
Originally posted by: ekkehard.gentz-software.de

Joel Rosi-Schwartz schrieb:
> Hi Ekke,
>
> Thanks once again. I did get it up and running

GREAT !

but I was getting a bit
> frustrated with the fussing :-( thus the post.
>
> What I would suggest to make Riena more approachable to new users is an
> OS agnostic install that could be added to an RCP SDK.
>

yes - would make things easier for newcomers

> Also thanks for the pointer to the Logging blog, I have perused it and
> will actually read it later in the day. Good stuff!
>
today part 2 will come out ...

ekke
> Many thanks,
> Joel
>
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