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Why does XWT use SWT? [message #476647] Thu, 06 August 2009 00:55 Go to next message
Jeeeyul Lee is currently offline Jeeeyul LeeFriend
Messages: 111
Registered: July 2009
Location: Seoul
Senior Member

XWT seems to very good and easy to implement design intention. I love
it, and thanks to great challengers.

But I think SWT has different philosophy, SWT aims to give friendly
native UIs to user. Support full css with SWT will be very hard because
of native resource restriction.

* So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *

And there is no computer which does not have graphic acceleration
hardware. So I think, Eclipse's new UI must consider this change of
environment. We don't have to use native UI for just fast response now.

Brand-new OS will provide own specific features, So SWT will cost more
much and much. New function will be delivered always late. And it just
give us poor restricted API.

SWT was good alternative solution for many years, But I think, not any more.
Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #479333 is a reply to message #476647] Mon, 10 August 2009 17:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Paul Webster is currently offline Paul WebsterFriend
Messages: 6859
Registered: July 2009
Location: Ottawa
Senior Member

I'm not sure how pluggable XWT renderers are (I think it is declarative SWT) but if not, you can work with/provide patches to XWT to plugin in a different renderer (I presume Swing is your initial target).

The Toolkit Model component in e4 is also a modeled UI, check it out (it might support pluggable renderers).

https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/e4-dev to get involved.

PW


Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #479367 is a reply to message #476647] Mon, 10 August 2009 18:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dilton McGowan II is currently offline Dilton McGowan IIFriend
Messages: 108
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:55:04 +0900, Jiyul wrote:

> XWT seems to very good and easy to implement design intention. I love
> it, and thanks to great challengers.
>
> But I think SWT has different philosophy, SWT aims to give friendly
> native UIs to user. Support full css with SWT will be very hard because
> of native resource restriction.
>
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
>
> And there is no computer which does not have graphic acceleration
> hardware. So I think, Eclipse's new UI must consider this change of
> environment. We don't have to use native UI for just fast response now.
>
> Brand-new OS will provide own specific features, So SWT will cost more
> much and much. New function will be delivered always late. And it just
> give us poor restricted API.
>
> SWT was good alternative solution for many years, But I think, not any
> more.

SWT is best of breed in my opinion. You get to code in Java and get an
application that looks like any other platform app. That rocks.
Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #479897 is a reply to message #476647] Wed, 12 August 2009 23:09 Go to previous message
Yves YANG is currently offline Yves YANGFriend
Messages: 688
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
XWT targets to be a Component-Based UI Foundation for ECLIPSE by providing:
- A common infrastructure that enables UI tools to work together
- Component assembling application development environment

The main goal is to simplify the UI development by grouping all UI solution
of eclipse together such as SWT/Jface, Data binding. It allows you to
separate the design and structure of your UI from the specific
implementation details.

XWT is defined to high extensible. The XML resource defines UI in abstract
way and using a dynamic UI element mapping concept (XAML). Of course, you
can change the behind UI library or extend.the standard one.

As for SWT, it does have a native implementation. But It doesn't means it
will be always native one. RAP has already an implementation of SWT in Ajax.
I rememeber there is a version in Swing. http://swingwt.sourceforge.net/

If you need a platform-independent and technology-neutral solution, eface
(htpp://www.soyatec.com/eface) is designed for this purpose. Same as XWT, it
relies on XAML Open Specification.

Best regards
Yves YANG
Soyatec - http://www.soyatec.com

"Jiyul" <jeeeyul@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:h5d9lm$eb3$1@build.eclipse.org...
> XWT seems to very good and easy to implement design intention. I love it,
> and thanks to great challengers.
>
> But I think SWT has different philosophy, SWT aims to give friendly native
> UIs to user. Support full css with SWT will be very hard because of native
> resource restriction.
>
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
>
> And there is no computer which does not have graphic acceleration
> hardware. So I think, Eclipse's new UI must consider this change of
> environment. We don't have to use native UI for just fast response now.
>
> Brand-new OS will provide own specific features, So SWT will cost more
> much and much. New function will be delivered always late. And it just
> give us poor restricted API.
>
> SWT was good alternative solution for many years, But I think, not any
> more.
Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #562163 is a reply to message #476647] Mon, 10 August 2009 17:25 Go to previous message
Paul Webster is currently offline Paul WebsterFriend
Messages: 6859
Registered: July 2009
Location: Ottawa
Senior Member

I'm not sure how pluggable XWT renderers are (I think it is declarative SWT) but if not, you can work with/provide patches to XWT to plugin in a different renderer (I presume Swing is your initial target).

The Toolkit Model component in e4 is also a modeled UI, check it out (it might support pluggable renderers).

https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/e4-dev to get involved.

PW


Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #562236 is a reply to message #476647] Mon, 10 August 2009 18:43 Go to previous message
Dilton McGowan II is currently offline Dilton McGowan IIFriend
Messages: 108
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:55:04 +0900, Jiyul wrote:

> XWT seems to very good and easy to implement design intention. I love
> it, and thanks to great challengers.
>
> But I think SWT has different philosophy, SWT aims to give friendly
> native UIs to user. Support full css with SWT will be very hard because
> of native resource restriction.
>
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
>
> And there is no computer which does not have graphic acceleration
> hardware. So I think, Eclipse's new UI must consider this change of
> environment. We don't have to use native UI for just fast response now.
>
> Brand-new OS will provide own specific features, So SWT will cost more
> much and much. New function will be delivered always late. And it just
> give us poor restricted API.
>
> SWT was good alternative solution for many years, But I think, not any
> more.

SWT is best of breed in my opinion. You get to code in Java and get an
application that looks like any other platform app. That rocks.
Re: Why does XWT use SWT? [message #562357 is a reply to message #476647] Wed, 12 August 2009 23:09 Go to previous message
Yves YANG is currently offline Yves YANGFriend
Messages: 688
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
XWT targets to be a Component-Based UI Foundation for ECLIPSE by providing:
- A common infrastructure that enables UI tools to work together
- Component assembling application development environment

The main goal is to simplify the UI development by grouping all UI solution
of eclipse together such as SWT/Jface, Data binding. It allows you to
separate the design and structure of your UI from the specific
implementation details.

XWT is defined to high extensible. The XML resource defines UI in abstract
way and using a dynamic UI element mapping concept (XAML). Of course, you
can change the behind UI library or extend.the standard one.

As for SWT, it does have a native implementation. But It doesn't means it
will be always native one. RAP has already an implementation of SWT in Ajax.
I rememeber there is a version in Swing. http://swingwt.sourceforge.net/

If you need a platform-independent and technology-neutral solution, eface
(htpp://www.soyatec.com/eface) is designed for this purpose. Same as XWT, it
relies on XAML Open Specification.

Best regards
Yves YANG
Soyatec - http://www.soyatec.com

"Jiyul" <jeeeyul@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:h5d9lm$eb3$1@build.eclipse.org...
> XWT seems to very good and easy to implement design intention. I love it,
> and thanks to great challengers.
>
> But I think SWT has different philosophy, SWT aims to give friendly native
> UIs to user. Support full css with SWT will be very hard because of native
> resource restriction.
>
> * So I wonder, Why XWT Uses SWT to render? *
>
> And there is no computer which does not have graphic acceleration
> hardware. So I think, Eclipse's new UI must consider this change of
> environment. We don't have to use native UI for just fast response now.
>
> Brand-new OS will provide own specific features, So SWT will cost more
> much and much. New function will be delivered always late. And it just
> give us poor restricted API.
>
> SWT was good alternative solution for many years, But I think, not any
> more.
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