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Home » Eclipse Projects » Dali » Batch tooling?
Batch tooling? [message #433949] Wed, 03 May 2006 11:46 Go to next message
Kevin Sutter is currently offline Kevin Sutter
Messages: 104
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi,
I'm sure this is another enhancement request, but I'm wondering whether
there's been any thought to providing a batch (command line) interface for
the DDL generation tooling? After the initial development activities are
complete, I could see where the "production" ddl generation could be a
build activity outside of the Eclipse environment. Has this capability
been a thought or is the ddl generation too dependent on the Eclipse ui?
Thanks for your thoughts.

Kevin
Re: Batch tooling? [message #433950 is a reply to message #433949] Thu, 04 May 2006 09:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Karen Butzke is currently offline Karen Butzke
Messages: 220
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Kevin,

I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

That said, this seems like an odd request to me. Maybe it's because of my
TopLink background which often supports large customers with legacy
databases. Also, purely using ddl gen would not lead to a well formed
database model. Just curious about your need for this feature.

thanks,
Karen
Re: Batch tooling? [message #433951 is a reply to message #433950] Thu, 04 May 2006 10:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kevin Sutter is currently offline Kevin Sutter
Messages: 104
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks, Karen, for the reply. Answers embedded below...

> Hi Kevin,

> I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
> and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
> gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
> but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
> them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
> and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

Okay, will follow up with the DTP team. Thanks.

> That said, this seems like an odd request to me. Maybe it's because of my
> TopLink background which often supports large customers with legacy
> databases. Also, purely using ddl gen would not lead to a well formed
> database model. Just curious about your need for this feature.

I agree that pure ddl gen would not be the "final answer" for creating
your database model. But, in general, I hate to be too dependent on a
ui-based editting environment. For example, suppose I have an Eclipse
project that I am doing some development on and my local database type is
Derby. There is another team somewhere that wants to see what I have, but
they don't use Eclipse (heaven forbid). And, they use MySQL instead of
Derby. It would be nice if my build script could kick off the ddl
generation for their database environment so that they could use, examine,
or test with my code without requiring an Eclipse/Dali setup. Sure, there
are multiple ways to work around this. And, I could probably live with
out, but I was just curious whether this type of function would be
available outside of the Eclipse ui environment.

Thanks,
Kevin
Re: Batch tooling? [message #433952 is a reply to message #433951] Wed, 10 May 2006 14:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kevin Sutter is currently offline Kevin Sutter
Messages: 104
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
>> I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
>> and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
>> gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
>> but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
>> them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
>> and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

> Okay, will follow up with the DTP team. Thanks.

FYI... After some discussion on the DTP forum, I just got agreement from
John Graham to create enhancement request 141112 to get this functionality
in place.

Thanks,
Kevin
Re: Batch tooling? [message #433980 is a reply to message #433952] Mon, 05 June 2006 14:37 Go to previous message
Leonard Theivendra is currently offline Leonard Theivendra
Messages: 36
Registered: July 2009
Member
As far as I know, DTP already has capabilities to run their DDL generation
operations in batch mode (i.e. DatabaseDefinition.getDDLGenerator() is
non-ui code).

I think the question is if the logic/processing in Dali that creates the
in-memory sql model for the database (based on the
annotations/orm.xml/etc) can be run in headless eclipse or not?

Karen/etc: are the plugins that house the code that does the above
ui-dependant?

Thanks,
Len
Re: Batch tooling? [message #585331 is a reply to message #433949] Thu, 04 May 2006 09:46 Go to previous message
Karen Butzke is currently offline Karen Butzke
Messages: 220
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Hi Kevin,

I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

That said, this seems like an odd request to me. Maybe it's because of my
TopLink background which often supports large customers with legacy
databases. Also, purely using ddl gen would not lead to a well formed
database model. Just curious about your need for this feature.

thanks,
Karen
Re: Batch tooling? [message #585345 is a reply to message #433950] Thu, 04 May 2006 10:57 Go to previous message
Kevin Sutter is currently offline Kevin Sutter
Messages: 104
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
Thanks, Karen, for the reply. Answers embedded below...

> Hi Kevin,

> I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
> and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
> gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
> but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
> them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
> and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

Okay, will follow up with the DTP team. Thanks.

> That said, this seems like an odd request to me. Maybe it's because of my
> TopLink background which often supports large customers with legacy
> databases. Also, purely using ddl gen would not lead to a well formed
> database model. Just curious about your need for this feature.

I agree that pure ddl gen would not be the "final answer" for creating
your database model. But, in general, I hate to be too dependent on a
ui-based editting environment. For example, suppose I have an Eclipse
project that I am doing some development on and my local database type is
Derby. There is another team somewhere that wants to see what I have, but
they don't use Eclipse (heaven forbid). And, they use MySQL instead of
Derby. It would be nice if my build script could kick off the ddl
generation for their database environment so that they could use, examine,
or test with my code without requiring an Eclipse/Dali setup. Sure, there
are multiple ways to work around this. And, I could probably live with
out, but I was just curious whether this type of function would be
available outside of the Eclipse ui environment.

Thanks,
Kevin
Re: Batch tooling? [message #585353 is a reply to message #433951] Wed, 10 May 2006 14:21 Go to previous message
Kevin Sutter is currently offline Kevin Sutter
Messages: 104
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
>> I think you should ask the DTP team about this. We are taking our model
>> and turning it into a DTP model and then using their wizard to do the ddl
>> gen. We would have a little work to do to put in the command line api,
>> but I am not sure if the DTP has non-ui based ddl gen either. I would ask
>> them about it(maybe they support it and we just aren't taking advantage)
>> and then enter an enhancement request against both products.

> Okay, will follow up with the DTP team. Thanks.

FYI... After some discussion on the DTP forum, I just got agreement from
John Graham to create enhancement request 141112 to get this functionality
in place.

Thanks,
Kevin
Re: Batch tooling? [message #588867 is a reply to message #433952] Mon, 05 June 2006 14:37 Go to previous message
Leonard Theivendra is currently offline Leonard Theivendra
Messages: 36
Registered: July 2009
Member
As far as I know, DTP already has capabilities to run their DDL generation
operations in batch mode (i.e. DatabaseDefinition.getDDLGenerator() is
non-ui code).

I think the question is if the logic/processing in Dali that creates the
in-memory sql model for the database (based on the
annotations/orm.xml/etc) can be run in headless eclipse or not?

Karen/etc: are the plugins that house the code that does the above
ui-dependant?

Thanks,
Len
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