Eclipse Community Forums
Forum Search:

Search      Help    Register    Login    Home
Home » General (non-technical) » Eclipse Foundation » Open source JDK project
Open source JDK project [message #42228] Tue, 14 November 2006 16:32 Go to next message
Marco Maccaferri is currently offline Marco Maccaferri
Messages: 132
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
As you know, Sun has recently started to release the source code of the
Java VM under the GPL license. I was wondering if the Foundation has any
plan on this matter.

One good starting point would be to have a 'Java VM plugin' that could
be included in the export process so that the applications are
completely self-contained, without the need for the users to install a
JVM before installing the Eclipse-based product. This would be very
useful for RCP applications.

What do you think ?

Bye
Re: Open source JDK project [message #42460 is a reply to message #42228] Tue, 14 November 2006 22:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse User
Originally posted by: alex_blewitt.yahoo.com

You can already ship an RCP with an embedded JRE, by placing the runtime in a subdirectory called 'jre'. It shouldn't be too hard to modify e.g. customTargets.xml to perform the copying for you if you wanted to, and had a suitable JRE to hand.

There's documentation about the layout at <a href=" http://help.eclipse.org/help32/topic/org.eclipse.platform.do c.isv/guide/product_config_install.htm">, and you can also put a -vm in the eclipse.ini file or put it on the command line if you want.

Incidentally, <a href="http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/">harmony</a> has been used to run Eclipse already :-)

Alex.
Re: Open source JDK project [message #42494 is a reply to message #42460] Tue, 14 November 2006 22:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse User
Originally posted by: eclipse4.rizzoweb.com

Alex Blewitt wrote:
> You can already ship an RCP with an embedded JRE, by placing the
> runtime in a subdirectory called 'jre'. It shouldn't be too hard to
> modify e.g. customTargets.xml to perform the copying for you if you
> wanted to, and had a suitable JRE to hand.

Eclipse supports it, but re-distributing a JRE is not just a matter of
shipping it with your product. IANAL, but the last time I looked into
re-distribution there were some hairy license terms that prohibited it.
That may have changed in the past couple of years, but I'd be surprised.
I think this thread was thinking of the possibility of Eclipse building
and shipping its own JVM implementation, instead of having to rely on
the (bloated) Sun implementation.

Interesting idea, but I'm not sure that falls within the charter of the
foundation.

Eric
Re: Open source JDK project [message #42516 is a reply to message #42460] Tue, 14 November 2006 23:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Marco Maccaferri is currently offline Marco Maccaferri
Messages: 132
Registered: July 2009
Senior Member
On 14/11/2006 23:14 Alex Blewitt ha scritto:

> You can already ship an RCP with an embedded JRE, by placing the
> runtime in a subdirectory called 'jre'. It shouldn't be too hard to
> modify e.g. customTargets.xml to perform the copying for you if you
> wanted to, and had a suitable JRE to hand.

Yes, I know that, however this has several problems. One is that the
JVMs are shipped as installable executable that must be run on the
target environment to have the files to package with the program, so you
need one win32 machine, one win64 (when available), one linux x86, one
linux x86_64, one Mac PPC, one Mac x86, one Solaris, etc. Another
problem is that the JVMs are not consistent across OSes so you are not
sure that the evironment is exactly what you expect.

I also believe that there are restrictions on the redistributable
license for the JVMs (at least Sun's JVMs). This maybe has changed with
the release of the source code, but you always have to deal with the OS
installations.

What I would like to see is a 'JVM pack' like the RCP delta pack that
can be used to automatically package the JVM compiled for the selected
target OSes, so that you can build the application from whatever OS you
are developing on and you are sure that the JVM is consistent to your
expectations because compiled from the same source.

Additionally maybe it is possible to remove all unnecessary code from
such VMs. For example an RCP application don't need the java plugin or
webstart systems, and I also believe that it would be possible to remove
Swing and AWT since we are using SWT (of course if you don't need the
SWT_AWT bridge). In other words, build a JVM that is specifically
optimized to be used with Eclipse and RCP applications.

Bye
Re: Open source JDK project [message #42547 is a reply to message #42494] Wed, 15 November 2006 00:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eclipse User
Originally posted by: alex_blewitt.yahoo.com

I agree that it's not within the remit of the Eclipse foundation, but remember that 'distributing a JRE' is not the same as 'redistributing the Sun JRE'. There are JREs that you can use to run Eclipse at the moment, though perhaps not taking advantage of everything (and certainly not Java (TM) compatible).

However, the existence of a version of a JRE that you don't have license to redistribute does not preclude there being any JRE that you can redistribute.

Alex.
Re: Open source JDK project [message #42608 is a reply to message #42516] Wed, 15 November 2006 02:52 Go to previous message
Eclipse User
Originally posted by: jeff_mcaffer.REMOVE.ca.ibm.com

Sounds like a fine community opportunity...

Jeff

Marco Maccaferri wrote:
>
> On 14/11/2006 23:14 Alex Blewitt ha scritto:
>
>> You can already ship an RCP with an embedded JRE, by placing the
> > runtime in a subdirectory called 'jre'. It shouldn't be too hard to
> > modify e.g. customTargets.xml to perform the copying for you if you
> > wanted to, and had a suitable JRE to hand.
>
> Yes, I know that, however this has several problems. One is that the
> JVMs are shipped as installable executable that must be run on the
> target environment to have the files to package with the program, so you
> need one win32 machine, one win64 (when available), one linux x86, one
> linux x86_64, one Mac PPC, one Mac x86, one Solaris, etc. Another
> problem is that the JVMs are not consistent across OSes so you are not
> sure that the evironment is exactly what you expect.
>
> I also believe that there are restrictions on the redistributable
> license for the JVMs (at least Sun's JVMs). This maybe has changed with
> the release of the source code, but you always have to deal with the OS
> installations.
>
> What I would like to see is a 'JVM pack' like the RCP delta pack that
> can be used to automatically package the JVM compiled for the selected
> target OSes, so that you can build the application from whatever OS you
> are developing on and you are sure that the JVM is consistent to your
> expectations because compiled from the same source.
>
> Additionally maybe it is possible to remove all unnecessary code from
> such VMs. For example an RCP application don't need the java plugin or
> webstart systems, and I also believe that it would be possible to remove
> Swing and AWT since we are using SWT (of course if you don't need the
> SWT_AWT bridge). In other words, build a JVM that is specifically
> optimized to be used with Eclipse and RCP applications.
>
> Bye
Previous Topic:[EDP] Mentors Council or Coaching Squad?
Next Topic:Eclipse Webinar on ATF
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Wed Oct 22 14:06:42 GMT 2014

Powered by FUDForum. Page generated in 0.01775 seconds
.:: Contact :: Home ::.

Powered by: FUDforum 3.0.2.
Copyright ©2001-2010 FUDforum Bulletin Board Software